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BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon

freda underhill 06 Aug 06 - 06:48 PM
Bill Hahn//\\ 06 Aug 06 - 07:43 PM
John on the Sunset Coast 06 Aug 06 - 08:49 PM
GUEST,number 6 06 Aug 06 - 08:54 PM
Little Hawk 06 Aug 06 - 09:03 PM
GUEST,Number 6 06 Aug 06 - 09:21 PM
John on the Sunset Coast 06 Aug 06 - 09:38 PM
GUEST,number 6 06 Aug 06 - 09:41 PM
GUEST,number 6 06 Aug 06 - 09:53 PM
Little Hawk 06 Aug 06 - 10:05 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 06 Aug 06 - 10:23 PM
John on the Sunset Coast 06 Aug 06 - 10:32 PM
number 6 06 Aug 06 - 10:33 PM
number 6 06 Aug 06 - 10:35 PM
John on the Sunset Coast 06 Aug 06 - 10:42 PM
flattop 06 Aug 06 - 11:04 PM
GUEST,Woody 06 Aug 06 - 11:58 PM
The Fooles Troupe 07 Aug 06 - 12:02 AM
The Fooles Troupe 07 Aug 06 - 12:07 AM
John on the Sunset Coast 07 Aug 06 - 12:14 AM
The Fooles Troupe 07 Aug 06 - 12:18 AM
The Fooles Troupe 07 Aug 06 - 12:23 AM
John on the Sunset Coast 07 Aug 06 - 12:24 AM
The Fooles Troupe 07 Aug 06 - 12:27 AM
John on the Sunset Coast 07 Aug 06 - 12:36 AM
The Fooles Troupe 07 Aug 06 - 12:38 AM
number 6 07 Aug 06 - 12:41 AM
The Fooles Troupe 07 Aug 06 - 12:45 AM
number 6 07 Aug 06 - 12:47 AM
The Fooles Troupe 07 Aug 06 - 12:48 AM
The Fooles Troupe 07 Aug 06 - 12:49 AM
number 6 07 Aug 06 - 12:52 AM
number 6 07 Aug 06 - 12:58 AM
John on the Sunset Coast 07 Aug 06 - 12:59 AM
The Fooles Troupe 07 Aug 06 - 01:00 AM
The Fooles Troupe 07 Aug 06 - 01:02 AM
number 6 07 Aug 06 - 01:03 AM
The Fooles Troupe 07 Aug 06 - 01:05 AM
number 6 07 Aug 06 - 01:05 AM
The Fooles Troupe 07 Aug 06 - 01:09 AM
The Fooles Troupe 07 Aug 06 - 01:11 AM
michaelr 07 Aug 06 - 01:16 AM
number 6 07 Aug 06 - 01:20 AM
number 6 07 Aug 06 - 01:22 AM
GUEST 07 Aug 06 - 02:25 AM
ard mhacha 07 Aug 06 - 04:16 AM
Q (Frank Staplin) 07 Aug 06 - 05:42 AM
The Fooles Troupe 07 Aug 06 - 06:03 AM
beardedbruce 07 Aug 06 - 07:13 AM
number 6 07 Aug 06 - 08:41 AM
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Subject: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: freda underhill
Date: 06 Aug 06 - 06:48 PM

why the world is silent


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: Bill Hahn//\\
Date: 06 Aug 06 - 07:43 PM

Glad I looked at this most one sided article. Interesting as well are the credentials of the author.

Let me, not so humbly, suggest a perusal of the NY Times magazine of 8/6/06 and the article---a most fair minded one---Henri Levy (French)that looks at all sides---and also who was attacked in the first place.

He also makes a very interesting point---the people appointed to high government posts (Defense, etc;) after the pullout from Gaza were "Doves" (Peacenicks--as he calls them). Now they are faced with doing what they have tried to avoid. Diplomacy would be nice but there are those, as we all know from public statements, that want Israel obliterated. Read --the "fascists" in Iran and their cronies.

No sense repeating what I posted on another thread but leaving Gaza and hoping for some constructive actions from the Palestinians (who Hezbollah, by the way, cares not a whit about) proved unfruitful to say the least.

I suggest a reading of the article because I think you will see both points of view---and the tragedy that Hezbollah is bringing on all sides.

A last thought--if you read the NY Times piece. I was struck by the similarity of their actions (Hezbollah) with the Lebanese people and the actions of Mayor Daley (the elder) who gave charity in return for votes to the citizens of Chicago. Hezbollah gives charity to their constituents and then uses their neighborhoods to launch rockets---sort of like the robber holding a hostage as a shield.

Bill Hahn


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 06 Aug 06 - 08:49 PM

Freda--

Your author states that the Geneva Conventions make the targeting of civilians illegal. True enough; it sounds as if she is about to criticise Hizbullah (alas, she is not). Your author fails to also state that to conduct war from amongst civilians, as does Hizbullah, is also illegal. Your author also wonders why the major countries seem to ignore Israli actions; perhaps it is because those on ground from those countries do not see Israeli actions as illegal as you and she do. Lastly, I am proud of the Israeli woman who cries over the deaths of Lebanese innocents...I hope there are many like her. No one should take satisfaction from killing of innocents. I do not recall seeing in that essay mention of any Hezbullah woman so crying with regard to innocent Israelis.

I normally do not like to cite specific sites--especially of groups that I generally disagree with. But as I suspect that you do generally approve of Human Rights Watch, I think you might read their site of 5-August. They blame Hizbullah for numerous violations since the current war began, and they are quite emphatic about it (I believe they use words to the effect that there is absolutely no justification for Hizullah targing civilian populations.) And, yes, deep in their report they also cite Israel for some of its actions. I hate moral equivalence, the non-thinking persons way to avoid analysis, which is why I generally don't read such sites.

[I would blue clicky it for you if I knew how]


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: GUEST,number 6
Date: 06 Aug 06 - 08:54 PM

"sort of like the robber holding a hostage as a shield."

... much like the Costa Nostra (protection racket).

"Article 85, Paragraph 3 of the Geneva Conventions states that making civilians the object of attack is illegal. Further, it states that launching an attack against civilian infrastructure breaches these conventions."

.... Hezbollah rockets being fired directly into civilian areas, packed with ball bearings ?????

sIx


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: Little Hawk
Date: 06 Aug 06 - 09:03 PM

"In its extreme form, the logic of victimhood does not allow room for even the possibility of there being other victims."

Exactly. And it becomes the justification for any number of blitzkriegs, any number of invasions, any number of atrocities on the part of the eternal self-appointed victims (as they see themselves).

That's the emotional engine that drove Nazi Germany into WWII and the Final Solution, and it's the emotional engine that drives Israel. It is also becoming the emotional engine that drives Israel's most bitter Palestinian and Arab and Persian foes.

It sees only itself as victim, only its own terrorist acts as justifiable (even noble), only its own losses as something to mourn. The USA, since 911, has also fallen into that same psychological trap of imaginary victimhood and that will cause further death and suffering in distant places as a result.

It's very stupid and unproductive behaviour all around...but predictable, when people simply cannot see past their own victimhood complex.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: GUEST,Number 6
Date: 06 Aug 06 - 09:21 PM

LH ... but is not an analogy to be found in the Hezbollah and the Nazis ... a political party formed with it's own paramilitary group ... providing rhetoric of fear, distrust and revenge against a neigbouring country and 'social services' to win over the populace.

sIx


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 06 Aug 06 - 09:38 PM

Little Hawk--you and all of you who insist on comparing Israel to Nazi Germany and the Final Solution thereby undercut any credibility the rest of your argument might have. It is odious and trivializes Nazism. Please show me the trains going to the gas chambers and concentration camps; show me the crescents on the garments of muslims or tattoos on their arms. Show me gangs of Jews rampaging through the streets of Tel Aviv destroying Arab homes and businesses, and just beating them up for the fun of it. Get real!


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: GUEST,number 6
Date: 06 Aug 06 - 09:41 PM

well said John ... and let's leave it at that.

sIx


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: GUEST,number 6
Date: 06 Aug 06 - 09:53 PM

BTW .... never trust and always be wary of a political party who has it's own paramilitary group ... especially if this political party is not the majority 'ruling'party.

sIc


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: Little Hawk
Date: 06 Aug 06 - 10:05 PM

I respectfully disagree, gents. The pyschology is very, very similar to that of the Nazis. The fact that the Israelis have not yet equalled the degree of physical crimes against humanity committed by the Nazis does not change the psychological underpinnings one iota. I'm not comparing the degree of the act involved, I'm comparing the psychological assumptions of victimhood and "master race/chosen people" that lie behind the policy, and I find them very similar. I also find the military doctrine very similar, as regards general tactical approach to campaigning.

And yes, 6, I DID indicate in my post that I think the most fanatical opponents OF Israel (which would include Hezbollah) are also adopting the same Nazi-like cult of "victimhood" and are abusing it in a similar fashion, using it to justify their violence upon Israelis...only they're not well armed enough to do the classic blitzkrieg warfare like the Israelis do it.


You know, Hitler was under the funny impression that the German people had been victimized horribly after the First World War. (well, actually, there was some reason for him to feel that way...but he exaggerated it out considerably of context...and he blamed the wrong people for it! Meaning, he blamed Jews and Communists, mostly.) He succeeded in convincing millions of Germans that they were victims...and that they would NEVER AGAIN be victims under his rule. He promised to restore the strength, diginty, and pride of the nation.

You tell me how that is psychologically all that different from the motivations that were driving Jews after WWII and have been driving them since? Same basic deal. You have a people in great trauma and distress who have taken terrible losses. You have a huge sense of collective grievance and persecution. You have a people utterly determined to NEVER AGAIN be weak in the face of an outer threat, and bent on securing military supremacy through an elite war machine second to none.

The reason you can't bear the thought of that comparison is...you don't want to believe that Jews could make the same terrible mistake the Germans did...and fall into the same darkness of intent.

Well, believe it. It's a tough pill to swallow, I know. Jews would have to step outside their accustomed group consciousness to do it. Most people are barely capable of stepping outside their group consciousness. In fact, they won't even consider doing so. They'll usually die first, rather than be that objective.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 06 Aug 06 - 10:23 PM

The Palestinian Arabs and Christians have been left with scraps of useless land on which most live as refugees. To me it seems Israel wishes to destroy Lebanon as well as a viable country, a goal far beyond neutralizing Hezbollah. I regard this as a form of genocide.

Hezbollah and Hamas would not have grown to threatening size if Israeli Zionists had not forced the Palestinians into a hopelessly marginalized position.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 06 Aug 06 - 10:32 PM

Little Hawk, aside from the psycho-babble you spout, do you enjoy making innacurate comparisons? You obviously have no understanding of the Jewish concept of being the 'Chosen People'; if you did you would not juxtapose it to 'master race'. I choose to believe that you are too honorable a person purposely make that comparison if you know better.
May I suggest you visit a rabbi in your area and get educated on the concept.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: number 6
Date: 06 Aug 06 - 10:33 PM

"Jews would have to step outside their accustomed group consciousness to do it."

... I've stepped out of my group consciousness (which by the way consists of about 3) and I totally disagree. There is absolutely no analogy as to what is is happening in these last tragic 3 weeks to Israel and the Nazis ... absolutely none.

Forget about 'victimhood' in relation to the Israelis ... they are a nation now protecting themselves ... brutal as war is.

Personally I wish both sides would 'step back'. Enough is enough.

sIx


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: number 6
Date: 06 Aug 06 - 10:35 PM

Excellent point John (aain) .... LH, I also suggest you do that. It certainly would provide some much undertanding.

sIx


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 06 Aug 06 - 10:42 PM

Q-The people who have marginalized Palestinean people are their Arab bretheren. They could have had a country in 1948, the first in their history. They, with the instigation of all the Arab countries chose to fight instead. But we've been through this before. Why is it that of all the countries established since 1948, and all the people who were displaced by border shifts, only Palestineans are still in so-called refugee camps? Did you know that Palestineans are amongst the most educated and successful Arabs outside of the camps? Why are the rest still there? And it isn't the fault of Israel.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: flattop
Date: 06 Aug 06 - 11:04 PM

Apart from politics, watch the technology.

Thick walled forts kept attackers at bay, more or less, until cannons rendered the walls useless. Then no one built stone walled forts.

Something similar is happening where plentiful and relatively inexpensive missiles are rendering older technologies ineffective.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: GUEST,Woody
Date: 06 Aug 06 - 11:58 PM

BERNARD-HENRI LEVY: A French Imposter


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 12:02 AM

"Why are the rest still there?"

Well there are these people living on the land they were expelled from...

"And it isn't the fault of Israel."

.....?


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 12:07 AM

"You obviously have no understanding of the Jewish concept of being the 'Chosen People'; if you did you would not juxtapose it to 'master race'. I choose to believe that you are too honorable a person purposely make that comparison if you know better.
May I suggest you visit a rabbi in your area and get educated on the concept. "

Seen from externally, such mental differences are a matter of 'faith'.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 12:14 AM

Foolstroupe, you obviously don't understand the Jewish concept of 'Chosen People" either. If you did you would not havemade such a glib dismissal of my comment. I suggest you join Little Hawk in gaining knowledge.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 12:18 AM

I watch a lot of SBS & DW TV news ...

"Please show me the trains going to the gas chambers and concentration camps"

With air supremacy, don't need that. Just flatten everything, including ambulances and fruit pickers

"show me the crescents on the garments of muslims or tattoos on their arms."

Don't need that - Israeli soldiers going to the front said interviewed said "there are no innocent civilians in Lebanon, there are only Hizbulla" - that means you can shoot up the UN too btw.

"Show me gangs of Jews rampaging through the streets of Tel Aviv destroying Arab homes and businesses, and just beating them up for the fun of it. "

Don't need that, with an Israeli Govt policy of destroying all Lebanon infrastructure, and air supremacy.

Just watch the news channels outside of 7, 9, 10 (Aussie commercial channels) and ch 2 (ABC must give a 'balanced picture' or the Aussie Govt howls if the 'balanced picture' differs from the Govt's view)


"Seen from externally, such mental differences are a matter of 'faith'."

Oh, I should have said - 'from an aethist external view'.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 12:23 AM

"comparing the psychological assumptions of victimhood and "master race/chosen people" that lie behind the policy, and I find them very similar."

Yep.

"I also find the military doctrine very similar, as regards general tactical approach to campaigning."

Yep.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 12:24 AM

Same response Foolstroupe; even an atheist could understand that concept, even if they did not believe in it.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 12:27 AM

"obviously don't understand the Jewish concept of 'Chosen People' either. If you did you would not havemade such a glib dismissal of my comment."

Perhaps, as an atheist, I don't WANT to 'understand' :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 12:36 AM

Nice chatting with you, Foolstroupe. If ignorance is bliss, you are the happiest Foolstroupe in the world. Perhaps I'll ignore you future ignorant comments and let you keep your head in the ground like the ostriches of your continent. :-] back at ya.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 12:38 AM

"even an atheist could understand that concept, even if they did not believe in it."

You keep missing my point because of your narrow mindedness engendered by 'Religious Training' (brainwashing, so that you cannot think outside the box you are trapped in) - ANY philosophy (whether promoted by Religion or not) that claims a superiority of one group or another is largely indistinguishable to students of history from Fascism. Focusing on simple superficial external factors like uniforms, flags, etc, overlooks the results of their actions, as well as their actions themselves, which many wise religious leaders have preached about as being more important that the simple externals eg, "wolves in sheep's clothing".

The Zionists in the 1930s were a bunch of fanatical religious terrorist zealots - just like the Germans, the Italians, and the Japanese - they HAVE however,achieved their political aims - expulsion of .

Fanaticism consists of redoubling your efforts when you have achieved or forgotten your original aims.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: number 6
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 12:41 AM

"Perhaps, as an atheist, I don't WANT to 'understand'"

regardless of beleif, or non beleif it certainly wouldn't hurt to understand .... that's the problem, people don't want to understand ... ah, the bliss of ignorance.

sIx


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 12:45 AM

"If ignorance is bliss"

Ah! that's why YOU can't understand that the Iranian Mullahs also believe exactly that same thing - that they are ALSO God's chosen people and that is why they must exterminate the Jews!

Fascist viewpoint too!


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: number 6
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 12:47 AM

Jews/Israelis/Zionists don't want to extermidate Muslims.

sIx


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 12:48 AM

"regardless of beleif, or non beleif it certainly wouldn't hurt to understand"

I was being satirical - I do understand only too well - as my other comments demonstrate!


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 12:49 AM

"Jews/Israelis/Zionists don't want to extermidate Muslims"

Bzzzzt!


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: number 6
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 12:52 AM

Show me proof of the mandate or any credible evidence of the Jews/Israelis/Zionist wanting to destroy all Muslims.

sIx


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: number 6
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 12:58 AM

Foolestroupe ...that's not the usual 'you' speaking there ... what, to much sun and drinkin' a bit too much Foster's today?? :)

sIx


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 12:59 AM

I don't know why I bother, but once more into the breech.
Jewish Chosen-ess has nothing to do with religious, racial or ethnic superiority, unlike Naziism and Master Race which had everything to do with racial and ethnic superiority.
Zionists, for the most part, from its inception were not religious zealots; contrariwise they were largely what we now call "ethnic Jews";    Theodor Herzl, the founder of modern Zionism, was such a person.
Now, whether one is a believer of any religion, an athiest, or an agnostic, the concept is understandable, if one choses to learn. Or one can choose not to educate oneself, and ignorantly spout poppycock.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 01:00 AM

Currently (and also for many years) they are working on destroying everybody, (and everything) Muslims, Christians, etc in Lebanon, and Gaza...


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 01:02 AM

"that's not the usual 'you' speaking there ... what, to much sun and drinkin' a bit too much Foster's today?? :)"

Ad hominen attacks prove that you KNOW you have lost the argument.

PS can't stand 'Fosters'


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: number 6
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 01:03 AM

Take a shower Foolestroupe ... cool down man .... that is absolute crap.

Totally lacking in any credibility at all .... ignorant paranoia, fear. Dangerous rhetoric is what it is.

sIx


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 01:05 AM

PPS it's bloody Winter! overcast as usual...


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: number 6
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 01:05 AM

"Ad hominen attacks prove that you KNOW you have lost the argument."

I havent lost anything ... show me credible proof man.

sIx


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 01:09 AM

"that is absolute crap"

Perhaps I should stop watching the news...

Dozens of Israelis dead, hundreds (thousands, depending on how far back you look) of 'neighbours' dead...

The Israelis are definitely winning the 'war of attrition'...


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 01:11 AM

'show me credible proof man.'

Played THAT game before! - nothing I can say will be accepted by you as 'credible proof'...


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: michaelr
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 01:16 AM

Little Hawk has offered the most intelligent analysis seen here so far.

Fact is, all sides in this are dirty. All the fighters whipped into a frenzy by religious demagogues, and the innocent pay the price. It is a disgusting spectacle - even more disgusting than what the Bush cabal is doing here at home.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: number 6
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 01:20 AM

For LH and Foolsetroupe any comparison of Israel to Nazi Germany is unfounded ... In Nazi Germani, Jews were not people, they were not allowed to have businesses, go to universities, let alone hold any public office or government seat .. well, you know the story, In Israel there are Christian, Muslim citizens ... Arab Israelis hold elected seats in the goverment, have businesses, goto universities. There are Arab Israelis in the army, in fact many of the units in the Gaza are Israeli Arabs ... they are protecting their homeland too ... in fact there are Arab Israelis casualties as a result of Hezbollah rockets hitting Damascaus, a city mainly populated by Arabs and Christians.

Foolestroupe ... I suggest you should watch other news coverages .. it is tragic there are a lot of innocent casualties in this war ... Lebanese and Israeli ... as I mentioned previously I wish Both sides would pull back. But with all this ignorant tripe about Israel/Zionist Nazis I have to argue back.

sIx

sIx


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: number 6
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 01:22 AM

"Played THAT game before! - nothing I can say will be accepted by you as 'credible proof'..."

... I'm more than willing to see any credible truth.

sIx


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 02:25 AM

http://news.yahoo.com/photo/060803/481/0d4bf4975624426492174d021ada116f&g=events/wl/080601mideast;_ylt=AnFfcQZNXNyvOPMSkWlBs5EUewgF;_ylu=X3oDMTA3bGk2OHYzBHNlYwN0bXA

Beirut before and after Israel's peacemongering. They're turning the city into a Warsaw ghetto.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: ard mhacha
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 04:16 AM

As one Lebbanon government offical remarked , "What Lebanon?, the country is in ruins", US WMDs are really big bombs.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 05:42 AM

"Chosen People." A dangerous concept that is causing untold misery in the Middle East.

I watched on BBCTV news as Lebanese who have had to flee their country joined Christians to march in a celebration in Damascus yesterday, and sang Hezbollah songs.

Israel may destroy Hezbollah as a viable force, but they are only guaranteeing that similar groups, born of despair and frustration, will rise to replace them and be even stronger.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 06:03 AM

"I suggest you should watch other news coverages "

I don't watch just US media, unlike some here. I watch about a dozen or more different international news coverages, as well as the local Aussie ones - SBS has direct feeds from most world language groups - you don't need to understand the languages completely to get the gist of most of the stories. Many of the stories on the local channels in English, just use fragments of the longer pictorials that are run in full on foreign language channels.



"ignorant tripe about Israel/Zionist Nazis"

Actions speak louder than words. Only the simple minded would say that Israel/Zionists are Nazis - but 'ye shall know them by their actions', a wise man once said.



"I'm more than willing to see any credible truth."

You have rejected everything so far put forward that reflects against your prejudices. So what would YOU accept then?

The Arab League was criticising Hizbullah at first for starting the mess. (For the moment, we'll ignore the murdering of civilians and bulldozing of houses in Gaza...) Now the Arab League is criticising Israel for 'excessive force'.

Historians will look back and quote this time as when the US lost world leadership to China.

A previous US president froze munitions deliveries until Israel stopped hostilities, which resulted in a very short offensive - why has George not done the same? The US is on the back foot in Iraq, and even Afghanistan. China outsmarted the USA by bringing the UN resolution about Israel's behaviour - the US veto (and dragging along 'allies' who have the tiger by the tail, and cannot let go!) is all that protected Israel.


BTW, the long range weapons (unguided rockets) that the Hizbullah are using are as accurate as the WWII V1 & V2 weapons, largely random (basically big dangerous fireworks) [in fact many are just copies of the WWII Russian ones] - light blue touch paper and stand back, and hope it hits something of military value. Which only makes the actions of the Israeli military, who can easily visually guide their weapons precisely on to ambulances (right in the centre of the red cross on the roof!) and precisely known UN positions, etc, even more relatively reprehensible.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: beardedbruce
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 07:13 AM

"BTW, the long range weapons (unguided rockets) that the Hizbullah are using are as accurate as the WWII V1 & V2 weapons, largely random (basically big dangerous fireworks) [in fact many are just copies of the WWII Russian ones] - light blue touch paper and stand back, and hope it hits something of military value. "

TRUE, making the point that Hezbollah is in violation of international law, and committing war crimes.


"Which only makes the actions of the Israeli military, who can easily visually guide their weapons precisely on to ambulances (right in the centre of the red cross on the roof!) and precisely known UN positions, etc, even more relatively reprehensible"

You have NOT addressed the stated point ( by the UN observer) that the Hezbollah forces are using such as human shields, and thus bear the guilt THEMSLVES for any civilian casualties.


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Subject: RE: BS: An interesting viewpoint on Lebanon
From: number 6
Date: 07 Aug 06 - 08:41 AM

Foolestroupe ... I was requesting credible facts from you in regards to your statement .. this current war going on does not in any way relate or have facts backing up your statement.

"Currently (and also for many years) they are working on destroying everybody, (and everything) Muslims, Christians, etc in Lebanon, and Gaza..."

In regards to your post informing us of the Hazbollah rockets you failed to mention that they are packed full of ball bearings for maximun human killing effect ... these rockes are not made to specifications on knocking out a military target.

The 'Chosen People' line and is definately being taken out of context here.

Guest ... if the Hezbollah had the weaponary ... Tel Aviv would look like Tokyo in August of 1945.

BTW ... no one picked up on my mistake in the above thread (07 Aug 06 - 01:20 AM ) ... I meant Nazerath, not Damascus.

sIx (not posting anymore to these current mideast conflict threads, is the bitterness that arises worth it here in the Mudcat)


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