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BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes

michaelr 27 Mar 04 - 04:30 PM
Donuel 27 Mar 04 - 04:32 PM
Little Hawk 27 Mar 04 - 04:38 PM
Peace 27 Mar 04 - 04:48 PM
Don Firth 27 Mar 04 - 05:03 PM
Amos 27 Mar 04 - 05:55 PM
Raedwulf 27 Mar 04 - 06:38 PM
Cobble 27 Mar 04 - 08:08 PM
GUEST,Clint Keller 27 Mar 04 - 08:08 PM
Cobble 27 Mar 04 - 08:10 PM
Cobble 27 Mar 04 - 08:13 PM
GUEST,guest from NW 27 Mar 04 - 09:16 PM
SINSULL 27 Mar 04 - 09:36 PM
Amos 27 Mar 04 - 09:53 PM
Amergin 27 Mar 04 - 10:09 PM
GUEST,pdc 27 Mar 04 - 10:16 PM
Bobert 27 Mar 04 - 10:25 PM
Peace 28 Mar 04 - 12:30 AM
Peace 28 Mar 04 - 12:32 AM
katlaughing 28 Mar 04 - 01:08 AM
Blackcatter 28 Mar 04 - 01:34 AM
Peace 28 Mar 04 - 01:45 AM
Strick 28 Mar 04 - 07:51 AM
GUEST 28 Mar 04 - 08:01 AM
Strick 28 Mar 04 - 08:06 AM
GUEST 28 Mar 04 - 08:09 AM
GUEST,Shlio 28 Mar 04 - 08:54 AM
katlaughing 28 Mar 04 - 10:02 AM
Donuel 28 Mar 04 - 10:14 AM
GUEST,pdc 28 Mar 04 - 01:14 PM
dianavan 28 Mar 04 - 01:14 PM
Peace 28 Mar 04 - 01:19 PM
DougR 28 Mar 04 - 01:33 PM
michaelr 28 Mar 04 - 01:49 PM
GUEST,guest from NW 28 Mar 04 - 01:54 PM
Donuel 28 Mar 04 - 03:08 PM
dianavan 28 Mar 04 - 03:34 PM
Metchosin 28 Mar 04 - 03:39 PM
GUEST,Clint Keller 28 Mar 04 - 05:39 PM
Jim McCallan 28 Mar 04 - 05:54 PM
GUEST,Clint Keller 28 Mar 04 - 05:55 PM
DougR 28 Mar 04 - 06:03 PM
Peace 28 Mar 04 - 06:04 PM
Jim McCallan 28 Mar 04 - 06:07 PM
Damon 28 Mar 04 - 06:44 PM
GUEST,guest from NW 28 Mar 04 - 08:17 PM
TIA 28 Mar 04 - 11:03 PM
DougR 29 Mar 04 - 01:57 PM
GUEST,Clint Keller 29 Mar 04 - 03:26 PM
Amergin 29 Mar 04 - 03:32 PM
CarolC 29 Mar 04 - 03:59 PM
Amos 29 Mar 04 - 04:22 PM
Bill D 29 Mar 04 - 07:33 PM
Raedwulf 29 Mar 04 - 09:47 PM
SINSULL 29 Mar 04 - 10:16 PM
GUEST,guest from NW 30 Mar 04 - 12:12 AM
GUEST,guest from NW 30 Mar 04 - 12:20 AM
Amos 30 Mar 04 - 12:29 AM
DougR 30 Mar 04 - 12:45 AM
Amos 30 Mar 04 - 12:52 AM
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Subject: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: michaelr
Date: 27 Mar 04 - 04:30 PM

Click for the 'PermaThread™: List of all joke threads'


The despicable smirking bastard has outdone himself again, making stupid jokes at a press dinner in front of a slide show that shows him looking under furniture in the White House, saying things like "those WMDs have to be somewhere... no, no weapons here..."

Meanwhile the death toll of American soldiers in Iraq approaches six hundred and is accelerating. I'm so outraged I can hardly see straight at the callous disregard the Resident and his henchmen display at every turn.

Story is here.

Care to excuse this one, Doug R?

Disgusted,
Michael


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Donuel
Date: 27 Mar 04 - 04:32 PM

"Whats the difference"

GWB


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Little Hawk
Date: 27 Mar 04 - 04:38 PM

Well, I think it's quite responsible of him to check behind the White House furniture for those pesky WMD's...


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Peace
Date: 27 Mar 04 - 04:48 PM

God Bless America.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Don Firth
Date: 27 Mar 04 - 05:03 PM

The man is a total twit!

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Amos
Date: 27 Mar 04 - 05:55 PM

Did anyone think he was more sensitive than that? Surely you jest??


A


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Raedwulf
Date: 27 Mar 04 - 06:38 PM

Ummmm... I ain't no fan of GWB, but I'm not quite sure what the issue is here. It is clearly stated that this is an event where the Prez usually sends himself up. Any topic that he chooses is likely to wind somebody up. I don't see that he was being directly or deliberately disrespectful to anyone, Iraqi, Other, or US (& yes, I placed the Yanks last in that list - notice how the published outrage is only outraged about a perceived insult to dead US servicemen...).

He is probably guilty of a bit of bad taste, but what this is really indicative of is the way that the modern media will happily blow something out of all proportion to the intention in the interests of making a story that will sell more copy. Especially when an election is looming...

Yours, A Cynical Bastard (yes, about WMD too, before you ask)


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Cobble
Date: 27 Mar 04 - 08:08 PM

The modern media dont need to blow some things up these arrogant ass-holes can do it all by themselves.

                  Cobble    (sub editor pa uk)


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST,Clint Keller
Date: 27 Mar 04 - 08:08 PM

Sending himself up? "Bit" of bad taste?

Oops! 13 more dead according to this morning's paper because of ol' humorous George's amusing mistake. The joke sure is on him. But he's a good sport about it.

If I had sent one man to death because of false information I gave I'd be filled with guilt and shame. I cannot imagine joking about it in front of their kin. And it's more than one; it's 500+ Americans & allies and thousands of uncounted Iraquis.

This isn't bad taste, this is callousness to a pathological degree.

clint


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Cobble
Date: 27 Mar 04 - 08:10 PM

Well said Clint.

    Cobble


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Cobble
Date: 27 Mar 04 - 08:13 PM

My last comment the inmates are running the asylum.

          Cobble.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST,guest from NW
Date: 27 Mar 04 - 09:16 PM

"Any topic that he chooses is likely to wind somebody up."

not true. if he's supposed to be funny and "send himself up" he's got plenty of personal foibles that could draw a lot of yuks. a little "misarticulation", a few of those goofy smirk poses, some jokes about how much a rich guy like himself knows about an average person's life, national guard service, etc. heck, i could've written his stupid routine myself!
but when he starts making jokes about the lies (his lies) that have cost hundreds of american and thousands of iraqui lives then he's long past bounds of good taste. the guy is clueless, tasteless, and heartless. and i really don't understand how people hear stuff like this and don't think of the families of the dead. including the media morons who were guffawing at the dinner. no wonder this country is in the state it's in.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: SINSULL
Date: 27 Mar 04 - 09:36 PM

My nephew posted this to his website. "Neither Here Nor There" is his weekly column.
Please excuse a proud aunt.

Neither Here Nor There
3/26/04

The Joke's On Us

I apologize for any grammatical errors in this piece.
I'm limiting myself to thirty minutes to write the
whole thing, editing and all. I'm mad. I want that to
come across.

Did you catch George W. Bush's performance this week at
the Radio and Television Correspondents Dinner?

Traditionally, this dinner has been a place for the
President to poke fun at himself, his staff and his
presidency. Past Presidents have cracked jokes about
partisan politics, their legislative rivals and
personal indiscretions. It's always been a
good-natured, and usually benignly funny, affair. But
this week George W. Bush poked fun at the fact that no
one has found any evidence of weapons of mass
destruction in Iraq.

With a slide show montage of himself looking behind
pieces of furniture in the Oval Office, George W. Bush
provided the narration, "Those weapons have got to be
here somewhere. Nope, no weapons under there. Maybe
over here." The audience laughed. But not many people
are laughing now.

The most polarizing president our country has ever seen
did it again.

You see, what George Bush did was not only poke fun at
himself, he poked fun at the fact that his railroading
of the Constitutional process, his obliteration of the
usefulness of the United Nations, his unilateral "with
us or against us" cowboy bullshit has sent almost 600
United States servicemen and women to their deaths in a
country we invaded for the specific reason of the
threat from weapons of mass destruction. Don't be
fooled by the Colin Powell/Donald Rumsfeld news
conferences we've been getting hammered over the head
with, those "Saddam was a bad man, we're better off"
speeches. I agree that we're better off. But we weren't
told that war was our only option because Saddam was a
bad guy. Again and again, our President told us that we
had to go to war to deal with the imminent threat of
Saddam Hussein's weapons of mass destruction. There is
a very big difference between these two lines of
thinking. And for the President to now find humor in
the fact that his number one cause for war turned out
to be built on lies and faulty/doctored intelligence is
insulting and demeaning to the American people.

Imagine if, just a few months after September 11th,
when we were still counting the lost and learning the
names of the dead, Bush had cracked the same jokes,
only this time saying, "Hmm, no al Qaeda under there.
No Osama bin Laden behind this cabinet." Imagine the
outrage.

You done imagining? Good. Now tell me what the
difference is between my little made up quote and what
he actually said the other night. I can't find it, and
I fail to see the humor.

And for a President who has, at best, a questionable
record when it comes to fulfilling his own military
obligations, to joke about an ongoing campaign that has
left hundreds of soldiers dead and hundreds more broken
and shattered, is beyond offensive.

I'll stay away from the bleeding heart liberal
argument, that of soldiers' families losing sons,
daughters, wives, husbands, mothers and fathers. There
is an element of truth to that. But in reality, the men
and women of our armed services signed up for their
jobs willingly. They knew that there was a strong
possibility that they would be put in harm's way. That
being said, there are right and wrong reasons for
having to step into a battle zone. We're in Iraq for
the wrong reasons. People are dying. Our President is
laughing. And there's nothing funny about that.

Please read on. The following people have died as part
of the war in Iraq. They were not in on the joke.

Jesse A. Givens
Sean C. Reynolds
Jason L. Diebler
Marlin T. Rockhold
Brian K. Van Dusen
Hans N. Gukeisen
Richard P. Carl
Cedric E. Bruns
Matthew R. Smith
Jakub Henryk Kowalik
Jose Franci Gonzalez Rodriguez
Nicholas Brian Kleiboeker
Patrick Lee Griffin Jr.
David T. Nutt
William L. Payne
Rashid Sahib
Douglas Jose Marenco-Reyes
Dominic R. Baragona
Andrew David La Mont
Timothy Louis Ryan
Jason William Moore
Aaron Dean White
Kirk Allen Straseskie
William T. Latham
Nathaniel A. Caldwell
David Evans Jr.
Mathew E. Schram
Brett J. Petriken
Kenneth A. Nalley
Jeremiah D. Smith
Jonathan W. Lambert
Keman L. Mitchell
Thomas F. Broomhead
Michael B. Quinn
Jose Amancio Perez III
Kenneth R. Bradley
Zachariah W. Long
Kyle A. Griffin
Michael T. Gleason
Atanasio Haro Marin Jr.
Branden F. Oberleitner
Travis L. Burkhardt
David Sisung
Doyle W. Bollinger Jr.
Jesse M. Halling
Michael E. Dooley
Gavin L. Neighbor
John K. Klinesmith Jr.
Andrew R. Pokorny
Ryan R. Cox
Shawn Pahnke
Joseph D. Suell
Michael L. Tosto
Robert L. Frantz
Michael R. Deuel
Paul T. Nakamura
Orenthial J. Smith
Cedric L. Lennon
Andrew Chris
Gregory E. MacDonald
Richard P. Orengo
Cory A. Hubbell
Timothy M. Conneway
Joshua McIntosh
Tomas Sotelo Jr.
Gladimir Philippe
Kevin Ott
Christopher D. Coffin
Travis J. Bradach-Nall
Corey L. Small
Edward J. Herrgott
David B. Parson
Jeffrey M. Wershow
Chad L. Keith
Barry Sanford Sr.
Craig A. Boling
Robert L. McKinley
Dan H. Gabrielson
Melissa Valles
Roger D. Rowe
Jason Andrew Tetrault
Christian C. Schulz
Joshua M. Neusche
Paul J. Cassidy
Jaror C. Puello-Coronado
Michael T. Crockett
Cory Ryan Geurin
Ramon Reyes Torres
David J. Moreno
Mason Douglas Whetstone
Joel L. Bertoldie
Jonathan D. Rozier
Jason D. Jordan
Justin W. Garvey
Christopher R. Willoughby
David A. Scott
Mark A. Bibby
Jon P. Fettig
Brett T. Christian
Joshua T. Byers
Raheen Tyson Heighter
Evan Asa Ashcraft
Hector R. Perez
Juan M. Serrano
Jonathan P. Barnes
Wilfredo Perez Jr.
Daniel K. Methvin
John Marshall Cheatham
Heath A. McMillin
William J. Maher III
Nathaniel Hart Jr.
Leif E. Nott
Michael J. Deutsch
James I. Lambert III
Justin W. Hebert
David L. Loyd
Farao K. Letufuga
Ronald D. Allen Jr.
Zeferino E. Colunga
Brian R. Hellerman
Kyle C. Gilbert
Leonard D. Simmons
Duane E. Longstreth
Matthew D. Bush
David M. Kirchhoff
Brandon Ramsey
Floyd G. Knighten Jr.
Levi B. Kinchen
David S. Perry
Craig S. Ivory
Richard S. Eaton Jr.
Daniel R. Parker
Timothy R. Brown Jr.
Taft V. Williams
Steven W. White
Eric R. Hull
Kenneth W. Harris Jr.
Bobby C. Franklin
Kylan A. Jones-Huffman
Michael Scott Adams
Stephen M. Scott
Vorn J. Mack
Pablo Manzano
Darryl T. Dent
Rafael L. Navea
Gregory A. Belanger
Anthony L. Sherman
Mark A. Lawton
Sean K. Cataudella
Jarrett B. Thompson
Joseph Camara
Charles T. Caldwell
Cameron B. Sarno
Christopher A. Sisson
Bruce E. Brown
Ryan G. Carlock
Joseph E. Robsky Jr.
Henry Ybarra III
Kevin N. Morehead
William M. Bennett
Trevor A. Blumberg
Kevin C. Kimmerly
Alyssa R. Peterson
Anthony O. Thompson
Richard Arriaga
James C. Wright
Brian R. Faunce
Frederick L. Miller Jr.
Lunsford B. Brown II
David T. Friedrich
Paul J. Sturino
Michael Andrade
Robert E. Rooney
Kyle G. Thomas
Robert L. Lucero
Christopher E. Cutchall
Darrin K. Potter
Andrew Joseph Baddick
Dustin K. McGaugh
James D. Blankenbecler
Analaura Esparza Gutierrez
Simeon Hunte
Tamarra J. Ramos
Charles M. Sims
James H. Pirtle
Spencer T. Karol
Richard Torres
Kerry D. Scott
Joseph C. Norquist
Christopher W. Swisher
Sean A. Silva
James E. Powell
Stephen E. Wyatt
Donald L. Wheeler
Douglas J. Weismantle
Jose Casanova
Benjamin L. Freeman
Kim S. Orlando
Joseph P. Bellavia
Sean R. Grilley
Michael L. Williams
David R. Bernstein
John D. Hart
Paul J. Johnson
Paul J. Bueche
Jason M. Ward
John P. Johnson
John R. Teal
Michael S. Hancock
Artimus D. Brassfield
Jose L. Mora
Steven Acosta
Charles H. Buehring
Joseph R. Guerrera
Jamie L. Huggins
Rachel K. Bosveld
Aubrey D. Bell
Jonathan I. Falaniko
Michael Paul Barrera
Isaac Campoy
Algernon Adams
Todd J. Bryant
Linda C. Jimenez
Joshua C. Hurley
Maurice J. Johnson
Benjamin J. Colgan
Paul F. Fisher
Keelan L. Moss
Ross A. Pennanen
Ernest G. Bucklew
Joel Perez
Frances M. Vega
Darius T. Jennings
Steven D. Conover
Brian H. Penisten
Paul A. Velazquez
Joe N. Wilson
Daniel A. Bader
Anthony D. Dagostino
Karina S. Lau
Brian D. Slavenas
Bruce A. Smith
Rayshawn S. Johnson
Francisco Martinez
Robert T. Benson
Jose A. Rivera
James R. Wolf
James A. Chance III
Sharon T. Swartworth
Kyran E. Kennedy
Paul M. Neff II
Scott C. Rose
Benedict J. Smith
Cornell W. Gilmore I
Morgan D. Kennon
Mark D. Vasquez
Gary L. Collins
Kurt R. Frosheiser
Ryan C. Young
Nicholas A. Tomko
Marlon P. Jackson
Genaro Acosta
Robert A. Wise
Nathan J. Bailey
Joseph Minucci II
Jacob S. Fletcher
Irving Medina
Scott M. Tyrrell
Jeremiah J. DiGiovanni
Ryan T. Baker
William D. Dusenbery
Eugene A. Uhl III
John R. Sullivan
Damian L. Heidelberg
Richard W. Hafer
Joey D. Whitener
Sheldon R. Hawk Eagle
Michael D. Acklin II
Warren S. Hansen
Kelly Bolor
John W. Russell
Erik C. Kesterson
Scott A. Saboe
Pierre E. Piche
Jeremy L. Wolfe
Timothy L. Hayslett
James A. Shull
Alexander S. Coulter
Nathan S. Dalley
Dale A. Panchot
George A. Wood
Joseph L. Lister
Gary B. Coleman
Damian S. Bushart
Robert D. Roberts
Jerry L. Wilson
Rel A. Ravago IV
Eddie E. Menyweather
Darrell L. Smith
Christopher G. Nason
David J. Goldberg
Thomas Sweet II
Ariel Rico
Aaron J. Sissel
Stephen A. Bertolino
Uday Singh
Raphael S. Davis
Clarence E. Boone
Arron R. Clark
Ray J. Hutchinson
Jason G. Wright
Steven H. Bridges
Joseph M. Blickenstaff
Christopher J. Rivera Wesley
Aaron T. Reese
Todd M. Bates
Richard A. Burdick
Jerrick M. Petty
Marshall L. Edgerton
Jeffrey F. Braun
Jarrod W. Black
Rian C. Ferguson
Kimberly A. Voelz
Kenneth C. Souslin
Nathan W. Nakis
Christopher J. Holland
Glenn R. Allison
Charles E. Bush Jr.
Edward M. Saltz
Stuart W. Moore
Eric F. Cooke
Christopher J. Splinter
Christopher F. Soelzer
Benjamin W. Biskie
Michael E. Yashinski
Thomas W. Christensen
Stephen C. Hattamer
Charles G. Haight
Michael G. Mihalakis
Michael J. Sutter
Rey D. Cuervo
Curt E. Jordan Jr.
Ernesto M. Blanco
Justin W. Pollard
Dennis A. Corral
Solomon C. Bangayan
Marc S. Seiden
Kimberly N. Hampton
Eric T. Paliwoda
Luke P. Frist
Jesse D. Mizener
Michael A. Diraimondo
Nathaniel H. Johnson
Christopher A. Golby
Philip A. Johnson Jr.
Ian D. Manuel
Aaron A. Weaver
Craig Davis
Jeffrey C. Walker
Gregory B. Hicks
Ricky L. Crockett
Keicia M. Hines
Kelly L. Hornbeck
Roland L. Castro
Larry E. Polley Jr.
Cody J. Orr
Edmond L. Randle
Gabriel T. Palacios
James D. Parker
Luis A. Moreno
Michael T. Blaise
Brian D. Hazelgrove
Ervin Dervishi
Jason K. Chappell
William R. Sturges Jr.
Randy S. Rosenberg
Keith L. Smette
Kenneth W. Hendrickson
Christopher Bunda
Adam G. Mooney
Patrick D. Dorff
Matthew J. August
James T. Hoffman
Sean G. Landrus
Travis A. Moothart
Luke S. James
Lester O. Kinney II
Cory R. Mracek
Eliu A. Miersandoval
Juan C. Cabral Banuelos
Holly J. McGeogh
Roger C. Turner Jr.
Armando Soriano
Seth J. Dvorin
Joshua L. Knowles
Jude C. Mariano
Richard P. Ramey
Thomas D. Robbins
Elijah Tai Wah Wong
Patrick S. Tainsh
William C. Ramirez
Eric U. Ramirez
Bryan N. Spry
Nichole M. Frye
Michael M. Merila
Christopher Taylor
Jeffrey C. Graham
Roger G. Ling
Henry A. Bacon
Stephen M. Wells
Matthew C. Laskowski
Michael R. Woodliff
Michael J. Gray
Gussie M. Jones
Matthew G. Milczark
Edward W. Brabazon
Richard S. Gottfried
Bert E. Hoyer
Christopher K. Hill
Joe L. Dunigan Jr.
Ernest Harold Sutphin
John F. Kurth
Jason C. Ford
Jocelyn L. Carrasquillo
Clint D. Ferrin
Daniel J. Londono
Joel K. Brattain
William J. Normandy
Michael R. Adams
Thomas R. Thigpen Sr.
Tracy L. Laramore
Ivory L. Phipps
Andrew D. Brownfield
Brandon Smith
Ricky Morris Jr.
Doron Chan
David M. Vicente

You think about that list, and you think about Bush's
laughing, smirking performance the other night. You
think about all of that when you head into the voting
booth this November.

More later
Sullivan


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Amos
Date: 27 Mar 04 - 09:53 PM

Thank you , Sins....it is very satisfying to see what has been a personal distress for many months suddenly starting to be articulated in the mouths of people who have more reach into the world than I do.   The murderousness of Bush's militarism and his politics of convenience just makes me spit. (expletives deleted).

Thanks again.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Amergin
Date: 27 Mar 04 - 10:09 PM

Thank you, Sins...that is a good article...for everyone to read.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST,pdc
Date: 27 Mar 04 - 10:16 PM

I had posted this on another thread, but following that article Sinsull posted, I think it may belong here. Please read it -- it's very well-written.

Veterans against War


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Bobert
Date: 27 Mar 04 - 10:25 PM

Gosh, between GUEST in NW and Sinsull, no reason for me to take up any one's time....

You all keep up the good work Junior Bush will keep up the bad work...

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Peace
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 12:30 AM

Thanks, Sinsull. I feel like punching my computer screen, but it's hard to see through the wet.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Peace
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 12:32 AM

Don't Americans have a leash for that guy?


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: katlaughing
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 01:08 AM

You've good reason to be proud, Sins, thanks for sharing that.

Please, everyone, remember to vote and get as many friends and family as you can to also get out and vote!!


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Blackcatter
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 01:34 AM

Ya know - the White House is actually more likely to contain WMDs than is Iraq. . .


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Peace
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 01:45 AM

Lord knows DougR and I have had some go arounds, but I don't think Doug would condone that type of thing from the White House or the President or anyone else for that matter. That was implied on the post that started this thread, and I wish to state that I don't agree with the remark. I generally do not agree with Doug's political views, nor he with mine, but I perceive him to be an honourable man, and I would be less than honourable myself if I didn't say so.

Bruce Murdoch


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Strick
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 07:51 AM

Normally I stay out of this kind of thread since "weapons of mass destruction" have become a sort of Pavlovian trigger for some people.   They foam at the mouth and respond, "Bush is evil! I hate him, I hate him, I hate him!" when ever WMDs are brought up. In this case all that happened was that Bush applied some self-deprecating humor to his biggest vulnerability. There are too many dead, but this is not how you show respect for them. Iraq was not only about weapons of mass destruction and it's easy to see who's really playing politics with the dead in this case.

That's not why I'm posting. All you 'Catters who are not Americans, you Brits and Canadian, all you others, look at the title of this thread and see what it's saying. 500 dead. 500 dead Americans. Have you noticed? Coalition dead don't matter. Iraqi dead don't matter. Saddam's murders don't matter. All that here matters is American blood.

This obsession with American blood is not a new thing. It's not a sign of rising Fascism, not just a conservative issue, if anything it seems (IMHO) more prevalent among American liberals. So long as we fight Clinton's kind of war where we sit a long way away and lob missiles to kill those we've decided to punish, who ever happens to be in the kill zone, everything's OK. It's like the violence in the movies and TV and video games that Hollywood insists on making, it's not real. "No Americans were killed in the making of this war" is all some need to see for everything to be all right. We don't see the dead, they don't exist. Nice and clean and antiseptic.

This is what should frighten you, not some neo-cons in the DC Beltway writing white papers and running computer simulations that ignore political and economic reality. They're too isolated from the real America to count, lost in a fantasy. That will sort itself out. Their influence will self-destruct at their next call for their kind of war.

What should keep you awake nights is that in the real America, we can make war so long as it's not us dying. We're working hard to automate our weapons, to take American crews out of our planes and tanks and ships so that we can use them whenever we want. Once we're free of that burden, who will we decide to punish next, when will one of our politicians decide to "wag the dog" to get out of a problem at home? Be honest: do you think that only one American party thinks America is always right and should tell other people what they have to do? Only one party plays politics with war?

This is the real evil at the heart of America, that some people only see half the horror of war and accept war when that half's not apparent. And look, here it is wallowing in hate again.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 08:01 AM

There is a plus sign after 500, Strick, and not enough room in the subject line for much more.

That's what I (as a brit) read from that.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Strick
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 08:06 AM

Funny, I count room for another 15 zeros in the subject line. No room in the line for 10,000+ killed in the war? Or 100,000+ when you throw Saddam's butcher's bill in?

Nice try, but that doesn't wash, Guest, and it's not just this thread that shows the attitude I'm talking about.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 08:09 AM

"look at the title of this thread and see what it's saying. 500 dead. 500 dead Americans"

It says 500 +, Strick, and it was the title of this thread you were talking about.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST,Shlio
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 08:54 AM

Strick, that always happens. Just like you, wherever you live, get local news on your tv. On my news, I get news of a UK strike before news of hundreds dead overseas.

Just because people are more likely to feel sympathy for those that they identify with.

Yes, it's heart-breaking. But it will happen until people stop thinking about americans, iraqis and british, and instead recognise that we are all human beings.

I can't see it happening soon...

Until then, I'm just glad that people realise that these deaths are shocking. Sinsull, I am amazed. You have every right to be proud!


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: katlaughing
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 10:02 AM

I sure don't see the word "American" in the title of this thread. We've had plenty of threads throughout the year in which many of us mourned the deaths of ALL involved in this shurbiasco.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Donuel
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 10:14 AM

Yesterday I filed to collect a reward for turning in the terrorist respondsible for 9-11. It was recently doubled to 50 million dollars.
I submitted the name address and workplace of Donald Rumsfeld.

It is a joke but with all earnestness.
Who knows. if more people start doing such things the growing murmur will begin to embolden people within the system to defy the special orders office in the Pentagon.

I am the last one to say I welcome a military coup but we have already had one in the form of a political neocon takeover of the military chain of command.
There is a growing faction in the military to defy the Cheney Rumsfeld stranglehold on the Pentagon and CIA.
There is talk of a mutiny.
This may be the next event bigger than an election of presidents.

Is a coup on the way, I don't know but this was recently said publicly by an American Admiral...
http://www.angelfire.com/md2/customviolins/bushoath1.jpg


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST,pdc
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 01:14 PM

Strick, if you think that Americans only care about American casualties, for God's sake read the link at my post on March 27 at 10:16 p.m. It's written by Americans who have actually been there, who aren't spouting rhetoric or pious patriotism -- they are discussing the reality of war.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: dianavan
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 01:14 PM

Donuel -

Exactly! If everyone took one small step of defiance, the Whitehouse would begin to feel the rumble. If the military decides to defy orders, all the better. It would be the final blow for the Bush administration.

d


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Peace
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 01:19 PM

Strick:

"They're [Neocons] too isolated from the real America to count, lost in a fantasy."

I usually am in awe of your thinking skills. Not in this case. Part of the problem we face with the NWO and Neocon agenda is the pervasive ability of the government to control media and other forms of communication. We are getting to the point where folks won't need to be brainwashed because a light rinse will do. You have more faith in the 'strength' of America than I do. The people are being made weak with a diet of lies and the obfuscation of truth. This happened before in other countries, and America will not be the exception to it happening again. The 'structural' integrity of the USA is being weakened by multi-nationals and the manipulation of money. The people are being fed an intellectual diet that is not healthy. I disagree with that conclusion on your part.

Bruce M


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: DougR
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 01:33 PM

Just two words, Michael, lighten up. It was a correspondence dinner. Presidents poke fun at themselves, traditionally, at that affair.

You wouldn't think Bush said anything funny anyway, anytime. Just another thing to poke at.

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: michaelr
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 01:49 PM

As the person who started and named this thread, I want to state clearly that I don't believe American lives are more valuable than Iraqui's. In fact, I may have more sympathy for an Iraqui civilian who finds himself in harm's way without a choice than I have for a US citizen who chooses to be part of the killing machine.

However, I expect the Resident to have no sympathy for those that are killed on his orders. I did not expect him to be so publicly callous about the sons and daughters of his constituency.

As to Doug R, I don't know him personally and so have no idea how "honorable" he is. I do know from reading his posts here that he is an unquestioning apologist for this regime. Nothing personal, Doug!

Cheers,
Michael


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST,guest from NW
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 01:54 PM

"What should keep you awake nights is that in the real America, we can make war so long as it's not us dying.
We're working hard to automate our weapons, to take American crews out of our planes and tanks and ships so that we can use them whenever we want. Once we're free of that burden, who will we decide to punish next, when will one of our politicians decide to "wag the dog" to get out of a problem at home? Be honest: do you think that only one American party thinks America is always right and should tell other people what they have to do? Only one party plays politics with war?"

in total agreement with you here, strick. no, both parties have played this wicked game at times. the guys doing it now seem to me to be playing with a lot more fiery situations than any other past admin dealt with. all the more reason to get them out. by the way, the first administration to use remote control war was not clinton (tho he did it too). it was bush the first in the gulf war.
also, on your other point you may note that my earlier post included american and iraqui dead references. i agree that it is evil to discount the innocent iraqui that have died in this sham.

dougR, please refer to my post of 27 Mar 04 - 09:16 PM for some reasoning as to why michael and others may feel a bit disgusted at GWB's hijinks. and you know, you still haven't responded to my documented bush lie over on the " popular views of the bush admin." thread. just don't want to admit that your boy can tell a lie or do you think the line i cited is just a joke too?


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Donuel
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 03:08 PM

A light rinse will do lol whoa thats funny

Doug R. I know the National Correspondents dinner well, I have video tapes of the last 14 dinners and some were incredibly hilarious.

I even made the last Clinton video shown at the dinner available on ebay available at cost until C-Span or some or another whacko threatened to sue me.

Drew Carey was a hoot when he made fun of Cheney a couple years back.

**************************************************************
But at no dinner had any President EVER BEFORE made fun of a war scenario in which lives were lost.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++=


I would be happy to make a couple DVD's available for of these dinners to people who are interested. I checked and C-Span is no longger selling the oldies.

Meanwhile I do not yet have the lastest Bush dinner.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: dianavan
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 03:34 PM

It would have been more appropriate if Bush had joked about himself being brain-dead.

d


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Metchosin
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 03:39 PM

Now if Clinton had looked under the table and said "Close, but no cigar," that would have been funny.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST,Clint Keller
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 05:39 PM

DougR & Teribus:

What I said was "If I had sent one man to death because of false information I gave I'd be filled with guilt and shame. I cannot imagine joking about it in front of their kin. And it's more than one; it's 500+ Americans & allies and thousands of uncounted Iraquis. "

You're not listening.

Doug, remember, Bush's little witticisms were broadcast and reported in the media. If a doctor prescribes the wrong drug and kills his patient do you think it'd be funny to joke about it to the victim's wife? Answer, please.

clint


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Jim McCallan
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 05:54 PM

Teribus hasn't been in this thread yet, clint....

;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST,Clint Keller
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 05:55 PM

My apologies to Teribus. That should have been addressed to _Strick_ and Doug.

clint


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: DougR
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 06:03 PM

What's the point of agruing about it? Those of you who are convinced it was a bad thing to joke about will never think otherwise.

As to the weapons of mass destruction, we ain't through looking for them yet! (I started to add a :>), but I don't want anyone to think I am insensitive.) :>)

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Peace
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 06:04 PM

Doug,

It WAS a bad thing to joke about.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Jim McCallan
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 06:07 PM

Where would you draw the line, when it comes to Bush's behaviour, DougR?

Serious question.

Jim


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Damon
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 06:44 PM

Maybe giving the order to prevent airforce interceptions on 9/11 was overstepping the mark?


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST,guest from NW
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 08:17 PM

"As to the weapons of mass destruction, we ain't through looking for them yet!"

the american task force that was looking for WMDs is no longer making a serious effort to find anything and hasn't since before david kay's report. check your news sources on that one dougR.

"What's the point of agruing about it?"

there is no point in arguing. however, reasonable people can discuss an issue, make points, cite factual information, back up their assertions with reasoning, and accept others viewpoints during the discussion as truly held but subject to debate. the key words here are "reasoning" and "facts". think about it.

still waiting for your comment on the bush lie i quoted on the "popular views of the bush admin." thread. are you just going to skip it, thereby conceding it is indeed a documented bush lie?


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: TIA
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 11:03 PM

DougR;

I believe I asked you this months ago - exactly how long does GWB get to look for the WMD? If, in 5 years they still haven't been found, will you still insist that they definitely exist, they just haven't been found yet.

I feel the same way about the tooth fairy, bigfoot, and leprechauns.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: DougR
Date: 29 Mar 04 - 01:57 PM

GUEST: Facts? The subject of this thread is the jokes Bush made at the Correspondence Dinner. It is a fact that he told them. It is a fact that some people disapprove of his telling them. It is a fact that some people don't disapprove. The poster ask for opinions, and he is getting them.

Whoever and all: no, I do not think the sun rises and sets on George W. Bush. Sure he has probably made mistakes. Who hasn't? My main concern is I think he is taking the right approach to eleminating terriorism. Find 'em and exterminate them.

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST,Clint Keller
Date: 29 Mar 04 - 03:26 PM

"My main concern is I think he is taking the right approach to eleminating terriorism. Find 'em and exterminate them."

My main concern is I think he isn't.

There are thousands of exterminated Iraqis & Afghanis who weren't terrorists. A lot of them weren't Saddamites, either.

Was it worth the exterminated Americans & other coalitiion members?

clint


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Amergin
Date: 29 Mar 04 - 03:32 PM

To me it is akin to Richard Butler joking about the Holocaust...


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: CarolC
Date: 29 Mar 04 - 03:59 PM

Problem with the way the administration is "finding 'em and exterminating them", for every one they exterminate, they create at least a dozen new ones.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Amos
Date: 29 Mar 04 - 04:22 PM

The deliberate extermination of humans who are not involved in waging war is called murder.

Not a nice word, considering how many citizens were gulled into waxing enthusiastic about it, but murder it was.

Who pulled that trigger?

Why, it was George, I think. Or Karl or Donnie.

A


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Bill D
Date: 29 Mar 04 - 07:33 PM

""My main concern is I think he is taking the right approach to eleminating terriorism. Find 'em and exterminate them.""

good GRIEF!...if a 4 year old kid learns that cockroaches are bad, and you notice that he has grabbed a hammer, and is gleefully bashing every one he can find--even the ones on the dishes and on Mom's big toe....do you complement him and make damned excuses for him? Or do you set him down and forcefully make the point that there are ways to do this, and ways NOT to do it?

Never mind answering, Doug, I know how it is...if a Republican president is 'in', he can do no wrong. If it happened to be a stupid Democratic president who decided to pull this stunt in Iraq, we'd be hearing a slightly different version of the value of this "terrorist elemination technique".


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Raedwulf
Date: 29 Mar 04 - 09:47 PM

good GRIEF!? Good Grief! is the display of personal biases evident in responses to this thread.

I'll say this again. I don't like Bush. He's an idiot at best, & this was in poor taste. So what? If you expect your president to be better than human, you're as dumb as he is & you've got the president you deserve. I have seen no evidence that he joked about the dead. He went "looking" for the WMD's that everyone's been getting on his back about for months on end. It was a joke. It was a lousy, unfunny, bad taste joke. Get over it. It wasn't a joke about the dead, it was a poor joke about the WMDs.

I think Bush is an idiot (did I already say that?), I won't attribute deliberate disregard & insensitivity to the man on the basis of this flimsy evidence. I can imagine that he does actually feel quite bad about all the US dead (Hey, SINS, nice piece of emotive journalism you quote there, BTW, all those names... Yank ain't they? I'm more concerned by the fact that the majority of UK deaths in the war 'proper' were caused by one Yank tosser on a jolly in an A10 who never seems to have been charged with anything. Great journalism, fucking lousy Truth - some other asshole who's forgotten the rest of the world exists as something other than either a target or a market, hey...). But it seems to me that way to many of you who are so quick to condemn would be far worse Presidents even than the cock-up merchant that Bush is.

Someone handed you a hard decision that was guaranteed to involve people dying, & you wouldn't know which why to run to get out of it... Kick the man (preferably out of office) for something that he's done (like lying through his back teeth), but spare us the indignation over something this inconsequential. This is a stupid faux pas that his PR people should have prevented. It didn't involve figuratively or literally putting a gun to someone's head & pulling the trigger.

Go to town on him because he lied to you about WMD's, about the reasons for the war, or about the fact that he couldn't run a piss-up in a brewery, never mind a country (& that costs lives indirectly, far more than you've lost in Iraq), but FFS don't waste your time over what is literally a bad joke!


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: SINSULL
Date: 29 Mar 04 - 10:16 PM

Yes R. All Yanks. In other threads I have made my opinion clear. Bush is responsible for the deaths of thousands of innocent people in Afghanistan and Iraq as well as for the deaths and maimings of military personnel on both sides - also innocent in my view. They were placed in jeopardy under false pretences. I will be sure to see to it that the "asshole" is made aware of your objections. He is, as I said, my nephew and I am extremely proud of his accomplishments as a writer and as an insightful observer of human behavior.

It is not necesaary to rant or say "fuck" to get my attention. I would probably give your opinions more credence had you not.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST,guest from NW
Date: 30 Mar 04 - 12:12 AM

"It was a joke. It was a lousy, unfunny, bad taste joke. Get over it. It wasn't a joke about the dead, it was a poor joke about the WMDs."

yes it was a pathetic joke. and it WAS about the dead (yanks and iraqi) because the people died due in large part to this prick's lies and misrepresentations about WMDs. and you're correct in that he should be kicked out of office due to many more serious wrongs. the only reason this is being talked about is 1.) this a chat forum and all people here do is talk about stuff (duh!) and 2.) it is a blazingly pure example of thr ignorance, insensitivity, cruelty, and heartlessness of the scum that currently floats on the top levels of our government.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST,guest from NW
Date: 30 Mar 04 - 12:20 AM

and concerning your "just get over it" remark, check out this article about brit hume's similar remark on sunday which includes, according to him, not just oversensitive people seeking "victim status" by their claims of being offended but also the families of the dead.

http://www.counterbias.com/news004.html


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Amos
Date: 30 Mar 04 - 12:29 AM

Excerpt"

Brit Hume, a conservative news anchor on the right-wing Fox News Channel, continued his staunch support for the Republican Party when he told critics of President Bush--including families of American soldiers killed in his Iraq war--to "just get over it", on the 28 March 2004 edition of Fox News Sunday.


When asked on-air about the criticism Bush had received, from Democrats and families of American soldiers killed in Iraq, concerning jokes about non-existent WMD during a White House event, Mr. Hume unsurprisingly defended Bush, calling his harshly-criticized jokes a "good-natured performance".


Mr. Hume then said of those critical of Bush's WMD jokes, including families of American soldiers killed on the premise that such weapons existed, that "you have to feel like saying to people, 'Just get over it'."


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: DougR
Date: 30 Mar 04 - 12:45 AM

Nope, you're wrong, Bill D. Had Bill Clinton done what Bush has done, I would have applauded him. I am critical of him because he didn't!

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Amos
Date: 30 Mar 04 - 12:52 AM

What -- commit murder? Makes ya proud, huh? Geeze Dougie -- shouldn't we re-think this one?

A


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: DougR
Date: 30 Mar 04 - 02:11 PM

Nope, Amos, no re-thinking required. The only way to defeat terrorists is to go after them and eleminate them. We've gone down this road many times on the Mudcat, Amos. Nothing new. Had Clinton reacted to 9/11 the way Bush did, I would have supported him.

Terrorism cannot be defeated by talking, begging, reasoning, or placating them. If anyone has a better suggestion for dealing with terrorists than elimination, I'd like to hear it.

Will innocent people be killed in the process? Unfortunately yes. The terrorist attacked us ...not we them. They declared war on us ...not we them.

If Kerry is elected, it will be the most disastrous thing to happen to the U. S. in it's history. Kerry will revert to the old democrat (read Clinton) soft approach to terrorism and that's the exact opposite of what should be done.

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Amos
Date: 30 Mar 04 - 02:20 PM

Well just to get this quite straight, Doug, the terrorists who attacked us were evidently a whole different kettle of terrorists than the ones we attacked. The connections between Hussein and 9-11 are nebulous at best, and certainly nowhere near enough to justify the deployment of millions of dollars worth of brute force. But we dove in, because we couldn't find anyone else to attack, having already bombed the bejeeze out of Afghanistan but apparently not with the success we hoped for - meaning an impact on the al Qeda network. Well, maybe we did unsettle them, I don't know.

Kerry has proven he understands the use of force.

Bush, as far as I can see, has proven that he does not.

A


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 30 Mar 04 - 02:30 PM

"Had Clinton reacted to 9/11 the way Bush did, I would have supported him"

Bullsh*t! Your lines come straight from Rush and Sean, and I've been a regular listener for many years. Please give me a citation for a single republican or conservative or otherwise Clinton opponent who, at the time he bombed Afghanistan and the Sudan said "that wasn't enough, we need to invade to eliminate terrorists!" Nope, sorry, all we heard was "wag the dog, wag the dog, wag the dog".

No offense, it's not just you, but there's a whole lot of support for party over principle going on.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: CarolC
Date: 30 Mar 04 - 02:47 PM

So, DougR, when Clinton responded to one of the terror attacks that occurred during his presidency by bombing sites in the country where the terrorists had their training camps, and he was accused of doing this to divert attention away from the Monica Lewinsky thing (remember - "Wag the Dog"?), did you support what Clinton did, or did you go along with the people who were criticizing him?


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Bill D
Date: 30 Mar 04 - 03:16 PM

well, I can see there are a few differences about what "go after them and eliminate them" should involve....golly, Doug- with that kind of logic, a few of OUR well-placed WMDs could solve all the problems, huh?

I tried, with the 4 year old metaphor, to make the point that everyone can agree that hunting down and eliminating terrorists is a good idea, but that selectively invading countries just because we sorta vaguely suspect them and the head honcho is a baddie is NOT the way to do it.

Saddam was a nasty fellow, but so are 10-12 others in countries who like seeing Americans suffer...how many of those countries are we gonna invade? And how much are YOU willing to spend to do it? And----do you really believe that we CAN "go after them and eliminate them" this way, when every attack just turns more Muslims into willing terrorists? We are not fighting an old fashioned war where the enemy is in uniform and operating from known bases! Bill Clinton at least knew THAT much!


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Kim C
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 01:48 PM

Not necessarily WMD's, but they were hiding something:

War Planes in the Sand

The President made a stupid, ill-advised comment, probably in an ill-conceived attempt to find some humor in a humorless situation.

Everyone who's never said the wrong thing at the wrong time, please raise your hand.

That's what I thought.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Bagpuss
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 01:56 PM

The "uncounted" Iraqi dead:

http://www.iraqbodycount.net/


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST,Teribus
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 02:04 PM

Interesting link Kim C,

On WMD, just out of curiousity, it would be interesting to know what folks expect they are looking for, in terms of size, weight and volume.

If you take the figures given by UNSCOM and the Iraqi's themselves as the basis, I think people would be quite surprised how small it is. Then remember that Saddam Hussein and his regime, who were past-masters at concealment and deception, had the best part of eight months to hide them.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Peace
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 02:28 PM

Kim C: Do you really like President Bush?


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: DougR
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 06:04 PM

Carol C, TIA, nope, I did not support Clinton when he lobbed the missle on the Aspirin factory. I still think he was "Wagging the Dog."

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST,Jim McCallan
Date: 31 Mar 04 - 06:21 PM

What dog is Bush wagging in Iraq, then, Doug?

Jim


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: dianavan
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 02:23 AM

...or what Bush is the dog waggin' about, anyway.

d


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST,guest from NW
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 03:06 AM

here is an exchange relating to clinton's "war on terror" activities from clarke's interview on tonight's MSNBC Hardball. it would seem that his activities were sincere according to clarke's read on it...

"MR. MATTHEWS:  Do you believe that Bill Clinton did his job as commander in chief with regard to the eight years you served under him in terms of preparing this terrorist attack?

MR. CLARKE:  Yeah, I do.

MR. MATTHEWS:  He did his job?  No complaints?

MR. CLARKE:  Oh, I have complaints.  I have a lot of complaints.

MR. MATTHEWS:  Let's hear them.

MR. CLARKE:  You want to begin with what he did do?

MR. MATTHEWS:  How about what he didn't do?  Let's get some balance here.

MR. CLARKE:  He did not, despite the fact that it seemed pretty obvious to me, order the bombing of the camps in Afghanistan, except once.  Now, when he did it the once, there was a huge uproar of Wag the Dog, and—

MR. MATTHEWS:  Sure.  Because he was involved with the whole Monica mess at that point in time.

MR. CLARKE:  And, and, and because of that, I think he may have been reluctant to do what he did.  But he said he would do it again if we got good intelligence about—

MR. MATTHEWS:  What about the Predator pictures we had of bin Laden down there in those camps and—we've got movies of them, in fact, at NBC—and they show a guy that looked very much like bin Laden and we had him in the targets, almost like in a movie, and didn't hit him.  What do you make of the president's culpability there?  Clinton's?

MR. CLARKE:  Well, the president's culpability is zero.  The CIA's culpability is huge.  The CIA required as a condition of doing that deployment in October 2000 that there be no weapon—no hit plan associated with it, because they wanted it to be an experiment and they didn't want to have to make decisions about command and control.  We could have had submarines off the coast waiting for the Predator video.  But CIA insisted that this just be an experiment to see if the Predator could find him."


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: LoosanaJack
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 07:32 AM

The latest death count is almost 600. I propose that george bush move his whole family, up to and including his slutty assed daughters, to Eye-Rack and run for president there. OR, join the local army and fight for "his" country.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 07:55 AM

"Had Clinton reacted to 9/11 the way Bush did, I would have supported him."

"I did not support Clinton when he lobbed the missle on the Aspirin factory. I still think he was "Wagging the Dog"".

Wow Doug, only about 18 hours between these two statements - agile mind you've got there.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Peace
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 05:22 PM

Doug is defending the President of his country--and I admire him for that. But Doug, Bush ain't givin' you much to work with.

What will matter is the next election. All elections seem important, and given the nature of democracy, I posit that all elections are important. To quote a friend of mine named Crooter, "You don't get to vote on the way things are. You already have." Just be extra careful with your vote this time 'round. It means lots to the US--and the rest of this planet.

Bruce M


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST,Tim D M
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 06:04 PM

I have been saying for a long time that a weapon of mass destruction can be found at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. Washington D.C. All Bush has to do is look in a mirror.


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Subject: bush and iraq
From: GUEST,3erakie
Date: 14 Apr 04 - 11:16 AM

Bush has outdone him self. The good work he is been doing is realy paying off. He got oil tanks transferd for onlly $4 a piece, each day millions of it. He surtenly freed iraq and all iraqi people.
saved the world from terroristes that might have WMD's in their little houses. What can i say he is really good in his job.

And about the little problems in falluja you dont have to worry.
He got some more troops coming. Besides he got the (terrorists) in his hand. He got some helicopters and F16 spraying the citys with some fire. Destroying the medicine centry and some hospitalls in iraq should help, so the wounded terrorists die faster. Shuting down the falluja grave place, so the dead (terrorists) cant even rest in peace.
Having some troops put some toxic in the samara water supply, so the (terrorists) cant even drink healthy water anymore.

Man i dont know if i should sum up more of his good work.
As long as Operation Iraq Liberty (OIL) is in the house, its al good for bush and some others round here..


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Apr 04 - 01:01 PM

actual picture of the end of his speech last night http://www.angelfire.com/md2/customviolins/bushapplause.jpg


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: michaelr
Date: 14 Apr 04 - 07:14 PM

Going on 700 now...


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Apr 04 - 07:23 PM

All in a good cause, though.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Peter K (Fionn)
Date: 14 Apr 04 - 07:54 PM

UK reports of the press conference have been including a sequence in which Bush was struck speechless by a simple question. (What was his biggest mistake post 9-11, and what had he learned from it?) After a painfully long pause, he said he'd have had a better chance of dealing with the question if he'd had written notice of it. Then after a further, agonising pause, during which he seemed to forget even where he was, he said that a response might eventually come into his mind, but that right then there was no sign of it.

Incredibly, one BBC reporter said that such "candour" would probably play well with Bush's supporters! But surely there's a lesson to be learnt: that every Reagan should have a Nancy who can come to the rescue in those awkward moments.

A strange paradox, though, that such a strong nation can find itself led by such donkeys.


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Subject: RE: BS: 500+ dead, Bush makes jokes
From: Metchosin
Date: 14 Apr 04 - 09:14 PM

Perhaps Peter, the power brokers in the US have become so cynical with regard to the electorate, that the only thing they believe is required of their political figureheads is that they be somewhat photogenic. Maybe that's why they seem to be positively disposed to movie actors, at least some actors can ad lib as well as memorize their lines.


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