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Scots Glossary - comments

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akenaton 19 Jul 03 - 07:02 PM
Sorcha 20 Jul 03 - 01:45 AM
GUEST,English Man 20 Jul 03 - 05:12 AM
GUEST,Q 20 Jul 03 - 03:18 PM
Maryrrf 20 Jul 03 - 04:13 PM
akenaton 20 Jul 03 - 04:52 PM
GUEST,Scabby Doug 21 Jul 03 - 08:05 AM
GUEST,Q 21 Jul 03 - 07:14 PM
GUEST,Q 21 Jul 03 - 07:23 PM
Hrothgar 22 Jul 03 - 05:04 AM
GUEST 22 Jul 03 - 12:28 PM
Big Tim 22 Jul 03 - 04:39 PM
akenaton 22 Jul 03 - 04:58 PM
GUEST,Scabby Doug 23 Jul 03 - 03:52 AM
akenaton 23 Jul 03 - 05:55 AM
akenaton 23 Jul 03 - 06:04 AM
Megan L 23 Jul 03 - 06:03 PM
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Subject: Scots Glossary
From: akenaton
Date: 19 Jul 03 - 07:02 PM

Iv just had a look in the new Scots Glossary...I think it must have been composed by an Englishman..Its full of errors,I wouldnt like to think our American cousins were being misled.Could somebody fix it.


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Subject: RE: Scots Glossary
From: Sorcha
Date: 20 Jul 03 - 01:45 AM

Actually, it was composed by an Aussie with lots of help from the Scots contingent. What do you want fixed? Please be specific.


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Subject: RE: Scots Glossary
From: GUEST,English Man
Date: 20 Jul 03 - 05:12 AM

What the hell is scots - surely you mean SCOTCH!!!

That's what you lot called yourseves up until around the mid 20th century. Now it' "oooh och I'm not scotch that's a drink"

Bunch of skirt wearing pansies I say


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Subject: RE: Scots Glossary
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 20 Jul 03 - 03:18 PM

Thread 19486: Glossary of Scottish Words

Additions? Corrections? The glossary has been useful to me. Perhaps the complainant is thinking in terms of older Scottish words, some no longer used, such as those in Robert Burns poetry.

There is an alphabetical glossary for Burns, with some words that could be appended to the main thread.

Like the language south of the border, some words were regional and would not be used by all Scots, and others were invented or modified to fit rhymes- not much point in adding these poetic aberrants since they can be figured out by referring to the root word.

Moreover, some people are very touchy about what they consider to be the "proper" word- use the wrong one and you have grasped an aizle.


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Subject: RE: Scots Glossary
From: Maryrrf
Date: 20 Jul 03 - 04:13 PM

The other thing to remember is that within Scotland there are different dialects and words - Lallands - spoken around Ayrshire, and Doric, in Aberdeenshire, for example. Then there are the archaic words that aren't used anymore in everyday conversation but that you might run across in poetry or songs. It would probably be extremely difficult to put together a complete and comprehensive Scots glossary, but the one on Mudcat is very useful.


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Subject: RE: Scots Glossary
From: akenaton
Date: 20 Jul 03 - 04:52 PM

Thanks for all the usefull comments but thankfully I had my aizle removed during a recent hernia operation so i feel confident enough to pursue the thorny problem further..
It would be a bit pedantic to go throughthe whole list but two on the first page stand out "A maiter o" is given as the scots equivalent of "as much as"..It should be "pertaining to"
"A thocht" is given as "the least bit"...what is that all about.
"A thocht or Ah thocht.......I thought
"Ae thocht.....One thought
Surely in a folk music site its important
that we dont end up singing like Rambling Syd...
          All the best Ake...


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Subject: RE: Scots Glossary
From: GUEST,Scabby Doug
Date: 21 Jul 03 - 08:05 AM

Yeah, but remember akenaton, it's a "Glossary" not a Scots Grammar or Dictionary.   While it's true that "Ae thocht" means "One thought", so would "yin thocht", and "ane thocht". Personally I'd have rendered
it as "A thought", depending on the source context, but from the context, the gloss given may be appropriate.

And as for "a maiter o'" - I can see quite easily how it could translate as "as much as" OR as "pertaining to", dependent on context.

Let's not beat people up over attempts to provide a resource. It's a very good effort, even if it's not absoultely perfect.   

Cheers


Steven


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Subject: RE: Scots Glossary
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 21 Jul 03 - 07:14 PM

'maiter' is also an old form of matter, as in 'it's a matter of.' Multiple meanings of some of these words. I agree, Scabby Doug. Complainants please make additions at the end of the thread, if you have authenticated usages to add.

More Scottish words at Scots Dictionary

An online Scottish Dictionary is scheduled for 2004, notice at this website: Scottish


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Subject: RE: Scots Glossary
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 21 Jul 03 - 07:23 PM

More at : Scots Dictionary


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Subject: RE: Scots Glossary
From: Hrothgar
Date: 22 Jul 03 - 05:04 AM

Make 'em learn English.


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Subject: RE: Scots Glossary
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Jul 03 - 12:28 PM

Hrothgar,

That's quite funny !

We do speak English, thanks !

I can only speak for myself. I don't know enough about all the different dialects to comment on them, but I am a Glaswegian living in Canada and I love to hear and use "OUR" vocabulary and expressions.

I would, in fact, like to see more school time being dedicated to kids learning to express themselves in their dialect, AS WELL AS teaching them a more international form of English.

What do you all think ?


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Subject: RE: Scots Glossary
From: Big Tim
Date: 22 Jul 03 - 04:39 PM

Along with the French Academy, I'm more concerned about creeping bicmacism, bulldozing might be a more accurate term; dominating and destroying the English language, in the broadest sense.

Actually, I'm not in the least concerned, but i don't like it.

On the other hand, my ancestors in Ireland all once spoke Gaelic, as did the people in this part of Scotland.

Plus ca change: excuse my French!


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Subject: RE: Scots Glossary
From: akenaton
Date: 22 Jul 03 - 04:58 PM

I couldnt agree more with the last message from Guest from Canada.
Now that im getting old certain things in life become more important,and one of these is the beauty and expressiveness of the old Scots tongue.I can remember when most of these old words were in commmon usage...and the language was rich and melodic.Im afraid to my shame i never learned Gaelic,but it too was spoken freely in our area.
The finest passage i have ever read on the old Scots language was written by Lewis Grassic Gibbon in Sunset Song...
"You saw their faces in firelight,fathers and mothers and the neighbours,before the lamps lit up,tired and kind,faces dear and close to you,you wanted the words theyd known and used,fogotten in the far off youngness of their lives,Scots words to tell to your heart,how they wrung and held it,the toil of their days and unendingly their fight.And the nextminute that passed from you,you were English,back to the English words so sharp and clean and true -for a while,for a while,tillthey slipped so smooth from your throatyou knew they could never say anything that was worth the saying at all"      I rest my case....


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Subject: RE: Scots Glossary
From: GUEST,Scabby Doug
Date: 23 Jul 03 - 03:52 AM

Aye, fair enough, akenaton...

But jist refresh ma failin memory for a wee, wull ye?

Whit leid wis yer mannie Grassic Gibbon screivin in? Whit's it cried again, it's oan the tip o ma tongue?

Oh aye, ah mind noo.

That's richt.

English.


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Subject: RE: Scots Glossary
From: akenaton
Date: 23 Jul 03 - 05:55 AM

Thanks Doug..But im sure youll have read a few of LGGs works.He uses old scots widely in Sunset song and other short stories,and sometimes its useful to write in another form to get your point across to a wider range of readers. I can understand your point but I think you know what Gibbon was saying..Best wishes Alex


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Subject: RE: Scots Glossary
From: akenaton
Date: 23 Jul 03 - 06:04 AM

Doug I forgot to add in my last post,Gibbon was referring to the Oral tradition which all us folkies should hold dear..Aw ra best...


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Subject: RE: Scots Glossary
From: Megan L
Date: 23 Jul 03 - 06:03 PM

All people should hold dear thier mither tongue, even a few of the english ones are reasonably pleasent though only a very few.*grins and pulls another dagger out of my back.


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