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1960's Australian Folk Albums

GUEST,Contact with Margaret Roadknight 08 Dec 10 - 08:40 AM
The Doctor 08 Dec 10 - 07:17 AM
Sandra in Sydney 08 Dec 10 - 06:58 AM
GUEST,Woody in Hughesdale, Melbourne 08 Dec 10 - 02:42 AM
GUEST 18 Feb 10 - 05:32 AM
GUEST,Doug Christie 01 Jun 07 - 07:43 PM
GUEST,Bruce, Sydney. 18 Apr 07 - 06:22 AM
Rowan 24 Mar 07 - 01:47 AM
Phillip 23 Mar 07 - 12:37 PM
Margret RoadKnight 23 Jun 06 - 09:22 PM
Sandra in Sydney 23 Jun 06 - 07:33 AM
freda underhill 22 Jun 06 - 09:15 AM
Sandra in Sydney 22 Jun 06 - 08:58 AM
freda underhill 22 Jun 06 - 07:10 AM
GUEST,John Cass 22 Jun 06 - 03:30 AM
Phillip 06 Jan 06 - 02:20 PM
Phillip 06 Jan 06 - 12:33 PM
Joybell 12 Aug 04 - 07:50 AM
Bob Bolton 11 Aug 04 - 07:07 AM
rich-joy 11 Aug 04 - 05:21 AM
GUEST,Gerry 11 Aug 04 - 01:06 AM
Bob Bolton 10 Aug 04 - 02:40 AM
GUEST,Gerry 10 Aug 04 - 01:41 AM
Bob Bolton 03 Apr 04 - 10:57 AM
Joybell 02 Apr 04 - 05:44 PM
Bob Bolton 01 Apr 04 - 08:49 PM
GUEST,Bryan Sutton 01 Apr 04 - 08:58 AM
GUEST,bobjack 23 Feb 04 - 03:35 AM
Bob Bolton 22 Feb 04 - 07:41 PM
Compton 22 Feb 04 - 06:56 PM
Bob Bolton 22 Feb 04 - 08:10 AM
Compton 21 Feb 04 - 07:38 PM
Bob Bolton 21 Feb 04 - 02:08 AM
Valda 21 Feb 04 - 12:49 AM
Bob Bolton 19 Feb 04 - 10:07 PM
Margret RoadKnight 19 Feb 04 - 08:28 AM
Valda 19 Feb 04 - 03:02 AM
Margret RoadKnight 19 Feb 04 - 02:37 AM
Valda 19 Feb 04 - 01:08 AM
rich-joy 18 Feb 04 - 07:58 AM
allanwill 18 Feb 04 - 05:32 AM
Joybell 15 Feb 04 - 07:35 AM
Sandra in Sydney 15 Feb 04 - 07:21 AM
Joybell 15 Feb 04 - 07:15 AM
rich-joy 15 Feb 04 - 02:59 AM
rich-joy 15 Feb 04 - 02:32 AM
rich-joy 07 Feb 04 - 08:54 PM
Sandra in Sydney 07 Feb 04 - 06:55 AM
Margret RoadKnight 07 Feb 04 - 12:04 AM
freda underhill 06 Feb 04 - 11:53 PM
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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: GUEST,Contact with Margaret Roadknight
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 08:40 AM

Thanks Sandra from Sydney....You're a doll:-)

Checked out website.....Will be in touch with Marg

Woody


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: The Doctor
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 07:17 AM

I've just spotted this thread. I have, I believe, copies of everything Martyn has recorded, including some he'd forgotten about, on CD, although I do have some of the original LPs. Anyone who is interested in/desperate for a copy of anything can either PM me or contact me through my website www.peter-taylor-folksinger.co.uk.


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 06:58 AM

Margret's website with contact details


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: GUEST,Woody in Hughesdale, Melbourne
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 02:42 AM

Dec 8th 2010 and I'm trying to contact Margaret Roadnight regarding a Reunion I am organising incorporating aspects of The Green Man in High St Malvern.
FYI.....The Green Man was about 80-90 metres down from Glenferrie Rd heading towards Kooyong Rd and is now a Liquor store and wine cellar.
However in the period from 1967 - 1970 it was very much part of the social formation of many a young lad from De La Salle College just down the road.

I can be contacted on :
woody707@bigpond.net.au
home/office tel no: (03) 9579 5156

Regards



Woody Wilson


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Feb 10 - 05:32 AM

can any one help me with a record or a copy of 'a wench, a whale and a pint of good ale' by martin wyndha-read etc? money no object, kerry murphy, 03 5985 6559, kerry@melbournepeninsula.com


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: GUEST,Doug Christie
Date: 01 Jun 07 - 07:43 PM

Hi,
I have a copy of The rare "Moreton Bay" Convict Origin. LP (Score Label Melbourne.) from 1963.
Brian Mooney, Martyn Wyndham- Read, David Lumsden. I will be listing this on EBay on the next few days. Seller CHRISVINY. Wonderful Condition Mint. Regards.


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: GUEST,Bruce, Sydney.
Date: 18 Apr 07 - 06:22 AM

To Margaret Roadknight, I was introduced to your and Graham Lowndes' singing by listening to Chris Winter's Room to Move radio program on ABC early 70's, and I must have seen you on GTK surely. I especially liked your version of Tully's 'Ice' very much. I did not realise Graham sang the version on Extradition's album, which I now have. I just got hold of a copy of Tully's 'Loving is Hard', which is very special to me - first time hearing it in 35 years.

Great singing, great memories. Please keep on doing what you do!


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Rowan
Date: 24 Mar 07 - 01:47 AM

Just a quick correction to a comment way above. Mick Slocum was not an original member of the Melbourne "Original Bushwackers & Bullockies Bush Band". That group coalesced from a mob (many of whom had some attachment to Melbourne Uni) that sang and played around Carlton and Mick joined them later when he left Canberra. Another person often regarded as an original member is Dobe Newton, but he joined even later.

Cheers, Rowan


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Phillip
Date: 23 Mar 07 - 12:37 PM

There's a copy of The Great Australian Legend for sale on ebay until 26th March. No bids at the moment, and starting at £9.something


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Margret RoadKnight
Date: 23 Jun 06 - 09:22 PM

Try Jeanette Gillespie at
gillespie.jeanette.f@edumail.vic.gov.au


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 23 Jun 06 - 07:33 AM

email from Danny May 2005 & I still haven't followed it up!

........................
The Morton Bay record did not include me and I am not sure where you
could get it. You could try Janette Gillespie Melboune Folk Club,
they did have a launch there which I sang at, Janette is on (03)
9481 6051 or 0414 73 26 67.
........................

sandra


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: freda underhill
Date: 22 Jun 06 - 09:15 AM

ta Sandra, and btw I have something for you

f.


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 22 Jun 06 - 08:58 AM

John, I spoke to Danny about that CD sometime back when I couldnd't locate it thru the CD shop catalogues, & he gave me a contact who might be able to help. I think i still have his email at work, so I'll have a squizz tomorrow & call you. If I don't have it I'll contact him again.

freda - the article has no more info than you quoted.

sandra


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: freda underhill
Date: 22 Jun 06 - 07:10 AM

Hi John

The Australian Folk mag Trad & Now website refers to issue Dec 2004 - Feb 2005 on page 37, which has an article by Malcolm J. Turnbull on the Early Years in Melbourne. It refers to a clipping from the Melbourne Age advertising a joint appearance at the East Brunswick Hotel (March 1999) of four of the best-known Melbourne folksingers of the 1960s: Martyn Wyndham-Read, David Lumsden, Brian Mooney and Danny Spooner. The occasion was the launch on Compact Disc of the landmark album Moreton Bay, originally released by the Score label in 1963.

If you can get that issue of Trad & Now, there may be more info about the launch & the CD. I have some issues of the mag, but not that one. you can make enquiries at www.tradandnow.com or email
info@tradandnow.com

best wishes
freda


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: GUEST,John Cass
Date: 22 Jun 06 - 03:30 AM

Hello everyone out there.

When I was a younger man, in the mid 1960's Australian folk songs - be they melodically based on British ballads and maybe the words were bastardised versions of British tunes, were very popular.
One of my favourite records was on the "Score" label and was called something like "Moreton bay and other songs, mainly of convict origin"
Featured artists were
Martyn Wyndham - Read
Brian Mooney (recently returned to Australia from a protracted stay of 20 + years in a county in the Irish Republic)
and David Lumsden, who played a Banjo, quite magnificentally.
I read recently on the Internet, that that record has been re-released on a C.D.
Does anyone out there have any more information on this including where the C.D may be purchased here in Melbourne, on what label it has been re-released etc.
Certainly would appreciate all help on this score (no pun intended)

Thanks in anticipation;

John Cass
03 9561-3541
0432-246-876


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Phillip
Date: 06 Jan 06 - 02:20 PM

In the end it went for £33, $58.


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Phillip
Date: 06 Jan 06 - 12:33 PM

There is a copy of The Great Australian Legend for sale on ebay. I've only just seen it, and there is only one hour left to go on the auction. At the moment it is selling for £6.33 - $11-something. The record is fantastic. I've only seen it for sale twice before. In the 1970s I got a copy for £3 second hand. About five years ago I saw it for sale at a record fair for £60.

The auction is nothing to do with me but if you like Bert Lloyd, Martin Wyndham-Read or Trevor Lucas, and if the hour isn't up I would run over there pretty quick


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Joybell
Date: 12 Aug 04 - 07:50 AM

The American influence on "Australian folk songs" has never been properly acknowledged. American miners, entertainers and sheet-music publishers had a considerable effect on Australian audiences during the 19th Century. Publishers of sheet-music deliberately targeted Australia as a new and profitable market. The fast American clipper-ships could reach here well before the slower English ships traveling the slower route. People waited on the docks for the very latest music. They were keen to be up-to-date and modern. The songs of Stephen Foster, and other American song-writers, became more popular than the songs that came here with the settlers. Joy


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 11 Aug 04 - 07:07 AM

G'day again Gerry,

It's wryly amusing to read what was said in some of the old notes! I especially like:

"... CLICK GO THE SHEARS ... Perhaps the most famous of the Australian bush songs, the tune is derived from an old English song, "Ring the Bell, Watchman". "

I wonder how some of the orignal cast members would have reacted to knowing that Click Go The Shears was a direct parody of an American song - Ring the Bell, Watchman ... written by Henry Clay Work to celebrate the ending of the American Civil War!

Ah well, we're surely making errors just as egregious - and might be spared to read of them in our dotage!

Regard(les)s,

Bob Bolton


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: rich-joy
Date: 11 Aug 04 - 05:21 AM

Timely resurfacing of this thread : "Reedy River" has JUST been put on again in Darwin, NT, by a Top End Folk Club and Cavenagh Theatre Inc collaboration (I THINK they last did it together in Darwin c.1982??? - or before ...) Anyway, 'Catters, Chris in Darwin and Tony in Darwin were in the Bush Band (and Tony played Alf, as well) ...

Wish I'd still been there to see it ...

Cheers! R-J


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 11 Aug 04 - 01:06 AM

Yes, Bob, that's the one. Here are the liner notes, followed by a few comments/questions of my own.

Front Cover

Diaphon Presents selections from REEDY RIVER        

Back Cover

Diaphon presents ... "Reedy River"

Excerpts from the Sydney production with the original cast - and their soloists - Milton Moore, Cecil Grevas and Jack Barry

"...Now still down Reedy River..."

I suppose that if I had not been pestered by members of the cast who were friends of mine, I would never have seen "Reedy River." It's funny how reticent most Australians (myself included, I must confess) feel about seeing and hearing the characters of our own country in epics about Australia. Australia to us often seems to lack the romance and colour of other countries, whose histories are forced with monotonous regularity down our throats, often in a very subtle and palatable way per medium of novels and films. That's how I felt about it all, anyway. I was very wrong, and, if you feel at this moment as I did then, my advice to you is, see "Reedy River," or, if you can't do that, relax and listen to this recording a few times. For here in Dick Diamond's play and in the authentic Australian bush songs that wend their way through it as surely and calmly as Reedy River itself (if it really exists!), you will find the real Australia. Here is no "Collet's Inn" in which the characters are merely European shadows against a highly romantic Australian setting. In "Reedy River" you will meet living people, and what colourful personalities they are!... Squatters, swaggies, barmaids, country schoolmarms, shearers and, of course, the eternal lovers. You will be carried by them to their campfires; to the country hop at the old school house, the Reedy River Pub, and then into the shearing sheds. You'll join with them in their joys and their little sorrows; and, what's more important, you'll feel very proud and very warm. That's why we, at Diaphon, were so eager to put Reedy River on disc. We felt that lots of people who had seen the show would like the opportunity of having a permanent memory of it, and we knew also that there were many people who would not have the opportunity of seeing it. For them, this album will be the first collection of Australian folk music sung by ordinary men and women, whose forbears helped to create it. It is the sincere wish and hope of Diaphon that we have been able to catch a little of the sincerity, the excitement and simplicity of the music which goes to make what the theatre itself terms "a show as warm as a handshake."

We take this opportunity of thanking the Management of new Theatre for their permission to incorporate many of the notes on the songs in our own cover notes. These are taken largely from the excellent Reedy River Song Book, which is available from any of the Australia-wide New Theatres.

Side One

Band One - "CLICK GO THE SHEARS."

Perhaps the most famous of the Australian bush songs, the tune is derived from an old English song, "Ring the Bell, Watchman". On this recording you hear Milton Moore with the Shearers and Bushwhackers' Band, consisting of lagerphone, bush bass, harmonica and guitar.

Band Two - "EUMERELLA SHORE."

Loius Lavater set these words to music. Originally they were sung to the tune of the old American song, "Darling Nellie Gray". This is the number that opens the show and is sung around the campfire by the shearers. The Eumerella, incidentally, is a river in South-Western New South Wales, and to-day the township of Neweralla is set on its banks.

Band Three - "FOUR LITTLE JOHNNY CAKES."

The scene is the Saturday night hop at the Reedy River Schoolhouse. Everyone is there; the girls in their Victorian best and the men for the most part looking most uncomfortable in a variety of "Sunday bests". In comes an old swaggy, who adds to the proceedings with this rendition of traditional lyrics set to music by Louis Lavater. The song is variously known as "The Whaler's Rhyme", "The Shearer's Song" and "The Black Fish Song". Cec. Grevas is the soloist.

Band Four - "REEDY RIVER."

Side one concludes with the "name song" of the show - "Reedy River". Chris Kempster, one of the cast of the Sydney production, and himself a well-known collector of folk music, has arranged the setting for the well-known Henry Lawson poem.

Side Two

Band One - "OLD BLACK BILLY."

We feel that if anyone was collecting recordings of authentic folk music from any part of the world he would find it very difficult to overlook this lovely example of the "troubador" styles. The tune is traditional, but the words were written or restored by Edward Harrington. On this particular recording the chorus work behind Cec. Grevas' solo gives one a feeling of acute nostalgia. This version was collected from a shearer in Melbourne.

Band Two - "BANKS OF THE CONDAMINE."

Like "Click Go The Shears", "Banks of the Condamine" has enjoyed a great amount of popularity since the late last century [sic]. Margaret Sutherland restored the music and Vance Palmer collected the words. It is in the usual line of British folk songs, which have for their story the wish of a girl to follow her lover to the sea or to the wars. However, in this case she merely wants to become a shearer.

Band Three - "REEDY LAGOON."

In its original version, this song was a swagman's lament. Both words and music are traditional, and it was collected by Lance Carew and Jeff Wills at Mataranka, in the Northern Territory.

Band Four - "BALLAD OF '91."

Comparatively recent in origin (although it probably was written for the first time at the end of the last century), this recording is, perhaps, the one that calls for the greatest vocal effort of the whole collection, for it is written in three parts, to be sung unaccompanied. The song tells, roughly, of the gaoling of a number of shearers at Rockhampton who refused to work in non-union sheds. The words are by Helen Palmer, and Miss D. Jacobs wrote the music.

Band Five - "WIDGEEGOWEERA JOE."

John Meredith, also a member of the Sydney cast and, perhaps, the possessor of the best collection of Australian folk music in the Commonwealth, collected this song on tape, from old-timer Jack Lee, who has since died. It is a parody on a very old Irish transportation ballad called "Castle Gardens", and is, therefore, possibly the oldest tune in the show. Jack Barry's boisterous rendering of this shearing song gives it a charm and drive that a more polished arrangement would completely lose. Once again he has the support of the shearers' chorus and the Bushwhackers' Band.

---KEN HANNAM

Now my comments/questions.

There is no date given anywhere on the album, but I'm sure Bob is right in dating it to 1954.

The liner notes don't always say who the soloist is on each track that has one. I'm not sure the information would mean much to me, as I know nothing about the three soloists anyway, but as an obsessive-compulsive I find the omission annoying.

The liner notes never identify by name any of the backing singers and instrumentalists. It's really odd that the notes identify the instruments played, but not the folks playing them! Chris Kempster is named as being in the cast and as writing the music for the title track but it never actually says that he sings or plays on the album. John Meredith is also mentioned but again it doesn't actually say he's on the album in any capacity.

The recording of Reedy River is just a few stanzas from the middle, both the beginning and the end of the poem/song are left out. Was it that way on stage, too?

I'm confused by the parenthetical comment on the Ballad of '91, "it probably was written for the first time at the end of the last century," especially since they then say the words were written by Helen Palmer. Were they thinking Helen Palmer wrote the words at the end of the 1800s? My understanding is she wrote it around 1950.

Anyway, I hope a few people will get something out of this, and maybe add to what I know about it. Gerry


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 10 Aug 04 - 02:40 AM

G'day Gerry,

That would be very nice of you ... even if you do slip under the bar set by alinact: "... 1960's ..."! That Diaphon recording would be, as you note, from the 1950s. Is that the one from the 1954 recordings of the Sydney production cast - including the (real - original) Bushwhackers Band?

Regards,

Bob Bolton


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 10 Aug 04 - 01:41 AM

I see that liner notes from several 1960s Australian folk albums have been posted here. I can post liner notes from the 1950s Australian folk album, "Diaphon Presents selections from REEDY RIVER," if they haven't already been posted here or elsewhere on the web.


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 03 Apr 04 - 10:57 AM

G'day Joy,

That ... or a similar photo ... also appears in the book/collection of Nariel tunes Music Makes Me Smile. I have an idea the photo comes from the 1969 Nariel Festival ... but need to check that one out.

Regards,

Bob Bolton


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Joybell
Date: 02 Apr 04 - 05:44 PM

I have a poster from Nariel Creek, 1972, which shows the "Bushwackers and Bullockies Bush Band" - written on their tea-chest bass. It was just before they dropped the "Bullockies" part of their title. Joy


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 08:49 PM

G'day Brian Sutton,

If by "The generally posted words..." you mean those in the DT, I must say they are much what I have usually heard ... and 'John in Brisbane' suggests he had them from a Lloyd recording. From where does your variant come?

In tracking down various versions one needs to check whatever versions Lloyd has given ... then compare with the source books he would have used. He never "collected", in any modern sense, in his Australian spell - rather he heard the songs in their native element - learned many - wrote a lot down in notebooks for his needs in remembering and singing them. (Information from Lloyd's private letter to Australian folklore collector John Meredith)

It was decades later that he became a "folklorist" - and he was not of one the 'purist' persuasion. Rather, he combined, edited ... made up from the whole cloth where it suited ... to mould songs that fitted the aims of the Working Mens' Song Group at EFDSS. It is quite possible that both versions you mention are different 'Marks' of the same song process.

All that said, it's one of the bywords that "there is no 'correct' version of a folksong". Sing what works for you ... and defend it with conviction.

Regards,

Bob Bolton


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: GUEST,Bryan Sutton
Date: 01 Apr 04 - 08:58 AM

The generally posted words for 'Maryborough Miner' do not quite fit my memory of A L Lloyds singing on a vinyl LP that I heard back in the late 60s of early 70s. It could have been Outback Ballads, it had a photo on the cover of a lot of desert with a shepherd and his two dogs in the middle distance. That version, as I remembered it, started 'Im a maryborough miner, as you may understand...' and later had the phrase 'my patent pill dispenser is the sure fire cure for gripes...' My problem is the usual version doesnt quite fit my remembered tune, also that second phrase is a gem. Can anyone help.


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: GUEST,bobjack
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 03:35 AM

Post no 100. I thank you. You have made an old Guinea Pig very happy.


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 07:41 PM

G'day Compton,

I have not seen any new records for several years - but they do have a website at: Bushwackers, so you can chase up their history and current doings.

(I note that they mention a new CD Ned ... presumably concerning my great-great-great-uncle Ned Kelly - but this record is not in their site's (2½ years out-of-date) list.

Don't take too much of the information on the site as gospel ... I recognised quite a few errors in a quick scan - and the 'Wackers' were never noted for letting the truth stand in the way of a good story (and they used to thrive on the publicity of looking innocent when anyone pointed out their errors!).

Their (full) name: "Bushwackers and Bullockies Bush Band" was sort of filched from the title of a 1960s/70s LP record with Martyn Whyndham-Read, Phyl Vinnicombe and Peter Dickie - called Bushwackers, Bullockies and Booze. The "Moreton Bay Bushwhackers" they mention on the website where actually a Queensland spin-off band from the original Sydney group just called "The Bushwhackers Band". In the late 1950s, all of what we would now call "Bush Bands" tended to be called "Bushwhacker Bands" because the Sydney group created the first definition of such a band.

(BTW: I was intrigued to note that the current incarnation of the rock-based "Bushwackers" has a graphic of the group ... in front of a lot of Sydney 'icons' - the Harbour Bridge, Opera House, Australia Square, &c ... rather than views of their 'native' Melbourne. Well, as a Sydneysider myself, I think that's natural ... but ... ?)

Regards,

Bob Bolton


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Compton
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 06:56 PM

How good that is, Bob...They were I remember a curious mix! but took Sidmouth Festival by storm!
I take it, they are still recording!?!


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 08:10 AM

G'day Compton,

They are .. in a sense ... still around (I heard, a year or two back that they took on member #57 ... their first female (Pamela Drysdale on accordion) ... I think Mick Slocum, a (~) 1969 original rocker may still be with them.

To further confuse the issue, an ealier "Bushwhackers" (with 2 'h's) started the Australian revival over 50 years ago ... but this lot of reformed rock & rollers had not heard of them!

Regards,

Bob Bolton


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Compton
Date: 21 Feb 04 - 07:38 PM

This thread is getting a bit long...but I remember with affection around 1974 a bunch of Australians turning up at Sidmouth festival in a converted ambulance. They were, if I can recall their full name,The Bushwacker and Bullockies Bush Band. Anyone else remember that far back?...and are they like me, still about??


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 21 Feb 04 - 02:08 AM

G'day Valda,

I knew the Burl Ives Australian Folk Song book came out in 1952, to coincide with his tour - what I need to do is track down the release date of the LP ... I just remember it as the next year.

Regards,

Bob Bolton


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Valda
Date: 21 Feb 04 - 12:49 AM

BURL IVES:
Roger Clarke, on his Waltzing Matilda site, says that 'Waltzing Matilda' was included in a sheet music album "Nine Australian Folk Songs" published by Allan's in 1952. It showed Burl Ives on the cover (timed to coincide with his visit here in 1952).

Here's a bit of trivia... (I'd like to see these though!)In the Burl Ives Collection in the Library of Congress' music division they have listed the fiollowing materials relating to his 1952 tour of Australia and New Zealand:

            Airline tickets and transportation
            Australia: Home for spastic children [photograph]
            Sydney Australia program
            Australia: "Variety" article
            Article on Australia for American newspaper
            Australian tour: Itinerary in Adelaide
            Article by Burl Ives on Australian folksongs
            Australian album presentation to ambassador
            Return to Australia
            Australian taxes
            Australian album after tour
            "Nine Australian Folk Songs" [album cover]
            New Zealand tax returns


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 19 Feb 04 - 10:07 PM

G'day Margaret,

Purely - from the foggy recesses of what I laughingly call my memory - the date 1953 arises, for the Burl Ives LP. I need to check that in printed texts, but I think it's about right!

Regards,

Bob


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Margret RoadKnight
Date: 19 Feb 04 - 08:28 AM

Appreciate the pointer to David's review of "Moving Target" - thanks, Valda!
And for the note re The Four Guardsmen.
Now to find out which year that Burl Ives album was recorded.....


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Valda
Date: 19 Feb 04 - 03:02 AM

Hello Margret.
Firstly, I thought I should tell you that a copy of David Mulhallen's review of your CD has been placed on FOLK AUSTRALIA.You can see it in the REVIEWS section here: http://folkaustralia.com/

Not sure if it means Denis Gibbons - I found it spelt that way on a website! Here's an interesting reference to the FOUR GUARDSMEN taken from, of all placed, a copy of Hansard (April 6 2000) in 2000:

"Mr Jack Neary, AM, OBE. was a giant of the Australian entertainment industry ... Jack Neary was a young policeman when he formed a quartet called The Four Guardsmen, entered it in Australian Amateur Hour and won. Success followed, and the quartet became national stars of radio and the Tivoli circuit.

Jack moved from entertainment to managing entertainers. Bobby Limb, John Laws and the orchestra leader Bobby Gibson all began their careers with Jack. Later he extended his activities, started booking overseas artists to come to Australia and moved into television production and film making. Jack brought many famous artists to Australia, including Winifred Atwell, Harry Secombe, Dave Allen and Jack Benny. He was involved in touring the von Trapp Family Singers, but the highlight of those years was his signing of the Beatles for their Australian tour. ..."


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Margret RoadKnight
Date: 19 Feb 04 - 02:37 AM

(Guess you're referring to Denis Gibbons, Valda).

Denis first recorded in 1954, and claims to have issued "the first ever recording of the original version of Waltzing Matilda" (more recently released on a Move Records CD in '95).

I'm wondering how his recording of Australian folk songs compared to, of all people, Burl Ives (who toured Australia in 1952, and learnt songs from the collection of Dr Percy Jones, as did Denis).

Burl Ives (with the Four Guardsmen - who were they?) issued a 10"LP on Columbia in the '50s of "Nine Australian Folk Songs", but who was first.....? (maybe a third part..?)


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Valda
Date: 19 Feb 04 - 01:08 AM

THE ANNETTE KLOOGER SHOW

ABC / x30m-e / 1959-61 black and white

Producer: Fred Maxian

Variety series hosted by Annette Klooger and featuring regulars such as Dennis Biggons, Frank Sheldon, The Unichords and The Ted Preston Quartet.

Quote from the MemorableTV /Australia site.... so they must have had a profile if they were regulars on a tv program ... interesting post!


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: rich-joy
Date: 18 Feb 04 - 07:58 AM

West Aussie DJs called it "Wiggle and Giggle", Allan!
(Thanks for the PM too - and no, these names don't ring any bells with me I'm afraid ...)

Cheers! R-J


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: allanwill
Date: 18 Feb 04 - 05:32 AM

OK, just to keep the theme going, try this one.

No date on this one but it is a "6 track 33W&G Compact LP" titled OUTBACK with the SOUTHERN FOLK THREE. It's on the W&G label (WG-Q-1851).

Side 1

1. WALTZING MATILDA (3.12)
   Cowan- Paterson (Allan)

2. BOTANY BAY (2.46)
   Trad. arr. Vincent (Woomera)

3. THE KELLYS' FATEFUL DAY (3.45)
   Campbell Vincent (Woomera)

Side 2

1. THE OLD BARK HUT (3.39)
   Trad. arr. Vincent (Woomera)

2. THE DYING STOCKMAN (2.40)
   Trad. arr. Vincent (woomera)

3. THE OLD PALMER SONG (2.08)
   Trad. arr. Vincent (Woomera)

In the past, many people have felt that Australian folk-songs offered little scope for musical originality. On this record, THE SOUTHERN FOLK THREE have engendered a new spirit and verve into songs which most people regard as being 'hackneyed and unimaginative'. Their musical sensitivity, coupled with a sympathetic feeling for the lyrics adds warmth and colour to the Australian folk scene.

Never before have these familiar songs been arranged and presented in such an exciting way. Listen to the haunting tone evoked by the unusual chords in "The Dying Stockman"; feel the lusty drive of "The Old Bark Hut" as the boys narrate this whimsical tale; witness the changing moods of "Waltzing Matilda" as fate ensnares the unfortunate swagman. Experience all of these sensations and more as you go "Outback with the Southern Folk Three".

And what of "The southern Folk Three".

Known throughout Australia as "The Unichords" these boys began their career whilst studying at Melbourne University. Of late they have been concentrating on their first love - folk music - hence the group's new name.

Bearded leader Campbell Vincent, a devotee of all folk music, is responsible for all the arrangements. A Bachelor of Music, his range of instruments includes five-string banjo, guitar, piano to name a few.

Charles Conlan, lead singer and a soloist in his own right, is largely responsible for the driving sound the group achieves while Laurie Arter provides the vocal bass and guitar accompaniment.... left handed!

We need say no more. You'll hear all about them!

Recording Engineer .. RUSS THOMPSON

Cover Design and Layout .. . KAREN

Recorded, Processed, Pressed and Issued through the Australasia-wide facilities of W&G


Just a couple of points - does our 60's (insecurity?) (paranoia?) (lack of confidence?) shine in some of these cover notes?

and does anyone else remember the W&G label as Wobble and Goggle?

Allan


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Joybell
Date: 15 Feb 04 - 07:35 AM

Great! Thank you Sandra. I'll contact Margaret. She was another singer I was too shy to talk to back in the 60s. Might ask her about her 60s show. I'll qualify next year and I wasn't too shy to perform in the 60s - though not in such prestigious venues as Traynor's. Joy


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 15 Feb 04 - 07:21 AM

Joybelle

Margret RoadKnight knows Shayna - she posted to this thread 29 Aug & here 'tis. Why not pm her?
.....................
29 Aug 03 - 03:29 AM

Incidentally, saw Shayna Karlin/Stewart (Extradition) in Brisbane this week.... apparently she doesn't perform anymore, but
she sang songs her Dad had nominated for his wake (Carter's "Crow on the Cradle" and Lehrer's "Irish Ballad").
And if we wait a coupla years she can join me in my "'60's" show (you have to be in your sixties & sing songs you performed
in the '60s)
Cheers
Margret


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Joybell
Date: 15 Feb 04 - 07:15 AM

Sandra, Shayna? Shayna Carlin?? She had a great influence on me at Frank Traynor's, along with Danny Spooner and Gordon McIntyre. Yes Cobber I was there too!. I named my first daughter after Shayna. Never told her of course, I was too shy to talk to anyone back then. Does anyone know her whereabouts now? I found a brief mention of her online but not much. Joy


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: rich-joy
Date: 15 Feb 04 - 02:59 AM

Well, I just went Googling and came up with a TINY fragment of the song that sounded VERY familiar!!
It is on a Bok/Muir/Trickett recording "So Will We Yet"(?), but was written by gay civil rights activist (a singer and quaker,too) BAYARD RUSTIN (1912-1987)

So WHO set Oscar to this piece??? Was it the mysterious Chris Couveau in PA?
Or, was it the deceased Colin Dryden, Down Under (no, NOT from the grave!! In OZ, I mean!!) No, maybe not, he would've been too young perhaps ...

Anyone any clues please?

Cheers!
R-J


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: rich-joy
Date: 15 Feb 04 - 02:32 AM

I've just come across a copy of "The Coffee House Songbook" OAK Pubs, NY, 1966 - in an opshop - which covers "... the tradition of folksong which we have found to be most favoured by semi-professional and often wandering Folk Singers of North America between 1959 and 1965 ..."

and Surprise! Surprise! it includes "The Ballad of Reading Gaol"!!!
Set to the music of "I Saw Her As She Came and Went" by Chris Couveau from Williamsport, PA - DOES ANYBODY KNOW THIS SONG, or this artist?????

Now many of the chords written on this copy are the same as those which Paul learnt for this song - but not being a musician, I cannot say if it's the same tune!! However, The EXTRADITION CD only credits "Oscar Wilde, arr Colin Dryden/Colin Campbell" ...

Anybody know any more details? (or should I start another thread perhaps?!)

Cheers!
R-J


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: rich-joy
Date: 07 Feb 04 - 08:54 PM

Hi Sandra - finally received my long-awaited copy of EXTRADITION too, just before Xmas -

Must admit however, that upon the FIRST hearing, Paul and I both felt that it was very
"of it's time" (retrospectively thinking) or,
"ahead of it's time" (at the time) or,
maybe they were just "out of it, at the time" :
i.e. we felt that perhaps we needed to be stoned to REALLY appreciate the FIRST half of the CD!!!

(and yes, we could just be getting too old, that's true!!!)

OK OK, so I'll go back and listen again (now that we're not so busy and stressed out pre-Woodford and Fire Events!)


The CD didn't contain all the tracks from the concert that Paul remembered with such "Nost"! but hopefully Dave Brannigan & Derryck Chetwynd's recording will cover them ...

The surprise for us was hearing Colin's recording of "The Ballad of Reading Gaol", that he set to Oscar Wilde's famous poem.
I've only ever heard Paul Lawler (ex Sydney/Darwin) sing that song - beautifully and heart-rendingly - and I think he learnt it from Gerry Hallom years and years ago, who also taught him a lovely guitar riff, that Colin Dryden doesn't do on THAT recording ... But I'd never heard anyone but Paul sing that song - s'pose it'll take on a new lease of life now!!!

ALINACT - are you going to continue with your early Oz recordings data, here???
We've really been enjoying Malcolm J. Turnbull's early Melbourne folk scene history articles in the "Trad and Now" magazine - hopefully, other cities will be included in the series???


Cheers! R-J


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 07 Feb 04 - 06:55 AM

nope, it's a bloke!!

notes say Colin Dryden & Shayna both do vocals but all I hear from her is the (finger?) bells. (Dave, when's the Colin Dryden album coming out?)

It's a powerful version, but like you I do prefer the Graham Lowndes' version I've listened to for almost 3 decades!

ICE
(Colin Campbell)

There is whiteness all around
Looking up I see no sky
Looking out I see no distance
Looking down I see no ground
Only cliffs of ice are moving
Frosty breath the only sound

I hear the ice
I hear the glaciers returning

sandra (listening to Extradition once again)


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: Margret RoadKnight
Date: 07 Feb 04 - 12:04 AM

Thanks for the info re Extradition released on CD, Sandra.
The version of "Ice" I learned from the LP was actually sung by a guesting Graham Lowndes (my nomination for the most soulful, and under-rated, Australian male singer, btw)......
I imagine the extra live version on your CD features another singer (Shayna?)


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Subject: RE: 1960's Australian Folk Albums
From: freda underhill
Date: 06 Feb 04 - 11:53 PM


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