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Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)

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GUEST,ratspituk@yahoo.co.uk 03 Jan 03 - 06:26 PM
nutty 03 Jan 03 - 06:48 PM
Keith A of Hertford 04 Jan 03 - 05:32 AM
GUEST 04 May 04 - 05:40 PM
breezy 04 May 04 - 06:01 PM
Folkiedave 04 May 04 - 06:05 PM
GUEST 04 May 04 - 07:19 PM
GUEST,harvey andrews 04 May 04 - 07:20 PM
GUEST,harvey andrews 04 May 04 - 07:23 PM
John MacKenzie 05 May 04 - 03:20 AM
GUEST,M'Grath of Altcar 05 May 04 - 04:45 AM
GUEST,harvey andrews 05 May 04 - 05:13 AM
GUEST,Raggytash 05 May 04 - 05:21 AM
GUEST,crazyhorse 05 May 04 - 05:24 AM
GUEST,Raggytash 05 May 04 - 05:30 AM
GUEST,Concerned of Huddersfield 07 May 04 - 04:06 AM
GUEST,dave c 25 Oct 04 - 03:06 PM
harvey andrews 25 Oct 04 - 04:05 PM
YorkshireYankee 25 Oct 04 - 06:09 PM
harvey andrews 25 Oct 04 - 06:35 PM
14fret 25 Oct 04 - 06:42 PM
harvey andrews 25 Oct 04 - 06:54 PM
Susanne (skw) 26 Oct 04 - 07:03 PM
YorkshireYankee 26 Oct 04 - 07:37 PM
GUEST,Dave B 25 Mar 05 - 05:24 AM
Susanne (skw) 25 Mar 05 - 07:56 PM
GUEST 21 May 05 - 07:07 PM
GUEST 22 May 05 - 05:26 AM
GUEST 22 May 05 - 02:14 PM
GUEST,Jon 23 May 05 - 02:08 AM
GUEST,Nick 22 Aug 05 - 05:57 PM
GUEST 22 Aug 05 - 06:54 PM
GUEST 23 Aug 05 - 01:19 PM
Susanne (skw) 23 Aug 05 - 07:16 PM
GUEST,Tír Chonaill 23 Aug 05 - 07:26 PM
GUEST 23 Aug 05 - 07:33 PM
GUEST,Tír Chonaill 23 Aug 05 - 07:42 PM
GUEST 23 Aug 05 - 07:54 PM
GUEST,Tír Chonaill 23 Aug 05 - 08:14 PM
GUEST,Tír Chonaill 23 Aug 05 - 08:18 PM
GUEST 23 Aug 05 - 08:28 PM
GUEST,Tír Chonaill 23 Aug 05 - 09:04 PM
GUEST,Tír Chonaill 23 Aug 05 - 09:08 PM
GUEST 24 Aug 05 - 05:12 AM
Wolfgang 24 Aug 05 - 09:41 AM
GUEST,Tír Chonaill 24 Aug 05 - 01:16 PM
GUEST,Tír Chonaill 24 Aug 05 - 01:23 PM
GUEST,Tír Eoghain 24 Aug 05 - 02:48 PM
GUEST 24 Aug 05 - 03:16 PM
GUEST,Tír Chonaill 24 Aug 05 - 10:38 PM
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Subject: Lyr Req: soldier by Harvey andrew's please!!!
From: GUEST,ratspituk@yahoo.co.uk
Date: 03 Jan 03 - 06:26 PM

please can anyone help me find the lyrics for "soldier" by Harvey Andrews? it's really hard to find any of his lyrics on the net so any help would be vary gratefull!!!
thanks
Mart


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: soldier by Harvey andrew's please!!!
From: nutty
Date: 03 Jan 03 - 06:48 PM

HI Mart ..... If you had spent a little time reading the threads you could have found it for yourself.

HERE

cheers


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: soldier by Harvey andrew's please!!!
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Jan 03 - 05:32 AM

thread.cfm?threadid=28801&messages=34

Try this link.


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Subject: Lyr Add: SOLDIER (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST
Date: 04 May 04 - 05:40 PM

In a station in the city a British soldier stood
Talking to the people there if the people would
Some just stared in hatred, and others turned in pain
And the lonely British soldier wished he was back home again

Come join the British Army! said the posters in his town
See the world and have your fun come serve before the Crown
The jobs were hard to come by and he could not face the dole
So he took his country's shilling and enlisted on the roll

For there was no fear of fighting, the Empire long was lost
Just ten years in the army getting paid for being bossed
Then leave a man experienced a man who's made the grade
A medal and a pension some mem'ries and a trade

Then came the call for Ireland as the call had come before
Another bloody chapter in an endless civil war
The priests they stood on both sides the priests they stood behind
Another fight in Jesus's name the blind against the blind

The soldier stood between them between the whistling stones
And then the broken bottles that led to broken bones
The petrol bombs that burnt his hands the nails that pierced his skin
And wished that he had stayed at home surrounded by his kin

The station filled with people the soldier soon was bored
But better in the station than where the people warred
The room filled up with mothers with daughters and with sons
Who stared with itchy fingers at the soldier and his gun

A yell of fear a screech of brakes the shattering of glass
The window of the station broke to let the package pass
A scream came from the mothers as they ran towards the door
Dragging their children crying from the bomb upon the floor

The soldier stood and could not move his gun he could not use
He knew the bomb had seconds and not minutes on the fuse
He could not run and pick it up and throw it in the street
There were far too many people there too many running feet

Take cover! yelled the soldier, Take cover for your lives
And the Irishmen threw down their young and stood before their wives
They turned towards the soldier their eyes alive with fear
For God's sake save our children or they'll end their short lives here

The soldier moved towards the bomb his stomach like a stone
Why was this his battle God why was he alone
He lay down on the package and he murmured one farewell
To those at home in England to those he loved so well

He saw the sights of summer felt the wind upon his brow
The young girls in the city parks how precious were they now
The soaring of the swallow the beauty of the swan
The music of the turning world so soon would it be gone

A muffled soft explosion and the room began to quake
The soldier blown across the floor his blood a crimson lake
There was no time to cry or shout there was no time to moan
And they turned their children's faces from the blood and from the bones

The crowd outside soon gathered and the ambulances came
To carry off the body of a pawn lost in the game
And the crowd they clapped and cheered and they sang their rebel song
One soldier less to interfere where he did not belong

And will the children growing up learn at their mothers' knees
The story of the soldier who bought their liberty
Who used his youthful body as a means towards an end
Who gave his life to those who called him murderer not friend


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: breezy
Date: 04 May 04 - 06:01 PM

and widely known in the army to this day judging by the comments I've heard in recent years.

Does Harvey know about this posting, if he does I hope he doesnt mind!

I'm looking forward to him playing St Albans on June 11th for the 3rd year running this time at the Duke of Marlborough.

We re-open this Friday with Graeme Knights


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: Folkiedave
Date: 04 May 04 - 06:05 PM

I saw Harvey sing this song on an RAF base. It went great, though I suspect some of the people whooping along missed the point.

Great song - and it was RAF Akrotiri - September 1980.

folkiedave


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST
Date: 04 May 04 - 07:19 PM

Folkiedave...you'd be amazed how many people missed the point, including the Govt and the Ministry of Defence. The key line is "the nails that pierced his skin" obviously a reference to nailbombs, but also a reference to crucifixion. Here were two warring factions, both killing each other, and both professing to have the truth about Christianity. So I put Christ in a uniform and he gave his life again that others might live.it may seem a naive song now but this was then, early 1970's.
The uniform was probably the step too far for many who could only see a soldier as a symbol and not as a human being.
At the moment we have the same thing with the torture pictures. Everyone is concentrating on the evil doers, but the ones who put aside their uniforms and their allegiances and their buddying to get these pictures released are the interesting ones. What has it taken for them to take such risks? In the end their humanity won out against their training and peer pressure. Their lives will be very difficult from this point, but if you want heroes...they're it.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,harvey andrews
Date: 04 May 04 - 07:20 PM

Above posting is from me. I'll go cookie chasing.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,harvey andrews
Date: 04 May 04 - 07:23 PM

By the way, I have a search that tells me which organisations etc access my website. US Military have been there a few times.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 05 May 04 - 03:20 AM

Well Harvey, surely you know there is a spy or a subversive lurking behind every tree, and as for folk singers, why they shouldn't be allowed! Bringing all those things to folks attention like that, it's shameful. ;~)
John


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,M'Grath of Altcar
Date: 05 May 04 - 04:45 AM

I used to go to folk club in Skelmersdale where one of the residents did the song just about every week. Don't get me wrong Mr. Andrews, it's a superb song, but this character just did tooooo often.

Until someone painted a football with black paint attached a lit sparkler and rolled it through the folk club door.........


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,harvey andrews
Date: 05 May 04 - 05:13 AM

Well, that's another priceless story for the archive!


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 05 May 04 - 05:21 AM

That person with the football and sparkler was non other than myself, Neil Hirst was the singer ........... he also ran the club until that night when he took his bat and ball home, packed up his guitar mid song walked out. I took his 3 guests and one guitar home in my MG Roadster (2 seater) with my good lady and my guitar (5 people, 2 guitars) I then went to Neil's house to offer apologies and to try and pour oil on troubled waters, he wasn't having any of it and I ended up running the eclub till it closed.
I must admit I also pinched the song from his repartoire and added it to mine,

Superb song Harvey, Cheers


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,crazyhorse
Date: 05 May 04 - 05:24 AM

I've sung this song twice in public once in about '73 at a catholic school PTA evening ( well I was young ) and once last year in canada in a bar. Both times part of the audience were sobbing their eyes out. This is one song that will always be "investigated seriously".


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 05 May 04 - 05:30 AM

The folk club in Skelmersdale was at the Knowle Brow pub, just for the record !, Story is circa 1978.

M'Garth I must know you, I married Christine Makinson who went to the club and to whom I'm still married I'm happy to say. Drop a line on a PM, see Punch the Horse thread for links I'm at work at the moment and don't have a cookie


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,Concerned of Huddersfield
Date: 07 May 04 - 04:06 AM

Brought this one back up as another thread has a request which can only be directed to Harvey, my advice to the Lady Guest who wants to hear "The Soldier" would be boost Harvey's a income tad and buy the CD


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,dave c
Date: 25 Oct 04 - 03:06 PM

does anyone know where i can download this song i heard it when i was a very young boy my father played once when we were driving and ive never heard it since, though ive never forgot it. so please let me know i would be very greatful


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: harvey andrews
Date: 25 Oct 04 - 04:05 PM

AAAAGGGGHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: YorkshireYankee
Date: 25 Oct 04 - 06:09 PM

dave c,

You certainly have good taste. Delighted (but not surprised) to hear that Mr Andrews's powerful, moving song left such a deep impression. It is a stunning song, so perhaps you would consider it worth helping the man who wrote it (and earns his living by writing that song – and many other wonderful ones) to earn his living – by buying the CD which contains that song. You can go to Harvey's website and order it here (click on the "Writer of Songs" CD; Solidier is on the list, and you should even be able to hear a brief excerpt of it if you click on the "mp3" icon).

I think it's safe to say that you will not find the entire song (or, for that matter, many (if any) of Harvey's songs – at least in full) available as a free download, because if all/many of his songs could be downloaded for free, people wouldn't have much incentive to buy his CDs – and he would not earn enough to live on. You may feel that rich musicians should not be bothered over whether or not they can wring a bit of money out of you, but rest assured that folk musicians (like Harvey) do not fall into this category.

Good luck to you. May you buy the CD – and enjoy this superb song for many years to come.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: harvey andrews
Date: 25 Oct 04 - 06:35 PM

Yorkshire Yankee...You're a scholar and a gentleman sir. I salute you!


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: 14fret
Date: 25 Oct 04 - 06:42 PM

Way back when.... I was shown lyrics written by Country Joe McDonald that predated Mr Andrews song. They were 'remarkably' similar!


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: harvey andrews
Date: 25 Oct 04 - 06:54 PM

It was actually a Robert Service piece.The folk process in subconscious action, although I didn't realise it at the time, and it was only two lines. Mea culpa.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: Susanne (skw)
Date: 26 Oct 04 - 07:03 PM

Harvey, just natural curiosity: Which were the two lines?

BTW, Yorkshire Yankee certainly is a scholar, but I'm doubtful about the 'gentleman' ... 'lady' would be far more appropriate! Hi Vicky!


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: YorkshireYankee
Date: 26 Oct 04 - 07:37 PM

Guten tag Susanne! I was considering posting something like:
"Although I'm not sure I qualify as a scholar – and I'm definitely not a gentleman – I will take that as a compliment."

But since you have clarified things, I no longer need to. ;-) Thank you!


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,Dave B
Date: 25 Mar 05 - 05:24 AM

Hi all,

Can anyone help, I'm learning to play guitar and I'd like the sheet music to Soldier and other of Harvey's folk songs. I bought "Writer of Songs", brilliant CD. It has inspired me so much that why I want to learn guitar..

Thanks

Dave


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: Susanne (skw)
Date: 25 Mar 05 - 07:56 PM

Dave, there's a link to Harvey's website a few postings up. Use it and write him an eMail. He's a gentleman, so I'm sure he'll help. Good luck with your guitar practice!


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST
Date: 21 May 05 - 07:07 PM

Does anyone know the name of the band who did a cover version of this song? It was on side B of a song(s) by the Angelic upstarts called "The thin red line" and "The Brighton bomb" The cover (from memory) of the LP was banned in the UK because it pictured Magartet Thatcher sat on a stick of TNT with her arms and legs blown off.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST
Date: 22 May 05 - 05:26 AM

it was the Angelic Upstarts


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST
Date: 22 May 05 - 02:14 PM

Duhhh Yeah of course it was! Don't know what I was thinking it was late! I much prefer thier version!


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 23 May 05 - 02:08 AM

Anecdote......
This song was banned by the BBC for many years, as too political.
Why is it that the "establishment" can never face up to the truth?

Also listen to "Anna My Love" by Harvey, probably my favourite.

But there again, almost anything by Harvey is great.

Dave B.......I don't have sheet music, I don't know whether Harvey has published any, but I do have chords for many of his songs. Which ones do you want? I'll try to help.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,Nick
Date: 22 Aug 05 - 05:57 PM

has anyone got the guitar tab/chords for Soldier?


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Subject: Chords Add: SOLDIER (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Aug 05 - 06:54 PM

A.E.E7.D.A (repeat)
D.A.E.E7.D.A (repeat)


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 01:19 PM

What incident is the song based on?


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: Susanne (skw)
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 07:16 PM

I could have sworn I posted the following in this thread some time ago. Can't find it, though, so here goes, from 'Lost Lives':

[1999:] 74. May 25, 1971   Michael G. Willets, West Belfast, Soldier, Parachute Regiment, 27, married

He was killed at Springfield Road RUC station by an IRA blast bomb thrown into the reception area. A car stopped outside the station and a man, described as dark haired and in his mid-20s, emerged with a suitcase which he hurled through the front door. Several civilians were sitting inside when the device was thrown. Among them were Patrick Gray, a 27-year-old electrician, his daughter Colette and their neighbour Mrs Elizabeth Cummings and her four-year-old son, Carl. In his book Bombs Have No Pity, Lieutenant-Colonel George Styles wrote: 'Immediately he saw the suitcase hit the floor, Sergeant Willets realised what was about to happen. He thrust the two children down into a corner and stood above them, shielding them as the 30lbs explosive in the suitcase went off. He was killed instantly but the children he'd protected escaped with their lives. The police inspector in the room was seriously injured and across the road a two-year-old, being pushed in a pram by his mother, was blown through a shop window. He was to regain consciousness only after months in hospital.'

In all, seven police officers, two soldiers and 18 civilians were injured. One of the policemen injured, Constable Ian Phoenix, had been chatting to Sergeant Willets just moments before the explosion. Constable Phoenix, who had served with the sergeant in the Parachute Regiment went on, after joining the RUC, to become a detective-superintendent. He was subsequently killed with other prominent anti-terrorist personnel in a Chinook helicopter crash on the Mull of Kintyre in 1994.

In their book, Phoenix, Policing the Shadows, Dr Susan Phoenix, the policeman's widow, and journalist Jack Holland give an account of the moments following the explosion. They write: 'Phoenix made his way to the entrance area, where he saw Sergeant Willets lying with the back of his head gaping open. A metal chunk from a locker hurled across the room by the force of the explosion had struck him. Local people had gathered outside and began to help clear the debris, offering what assistance they could. Ambulances began ferrying the injured to the nearby Royal Victoria Hospital. Lieutenant-Colonel (Peter) Chiswell was with Sergeant Willets, who was taken out on a door to the ambulance. A crowd of youths were waiting to greet them. They started to jeer and scream obscenities at the badly wounded soldiers. Said Chiswell, "My reaction was one of total disbelief that anyone could be so inhumane."'

Alan Judd, later an author, was a soldier writing at a desk in a room over the reception area. 'A jagged jet of flame shot up through the floor in front of me and I felt a hot stinging shock through the soles of my boots, the seat of my chair and my calves and thighs. I don't think I hit the ceiling, but I believe the desk did and the inkwell certainly did; its remains were later found embedded.'

The sergeant, who had been due to leave Northern Ireland with his regiment's 3rd battalion in a few days, died after two hours on the operating table. He was the first member of the Parachute Regiment killed in the troubles. In his book, Lieutenant-Colonel Styles added: 'Sadly, the family of the little boy blown into the shop were going to be hurt again through the terrorist war. One night the army broke up barricades set up in their street. The armoured bulldozer picked up the rubble of the barricade and shoved it straight into the front room of that family's house. Such families are the true victims of terrorism.'

Patrick Gray later described the dead sergeant as a hero. The paratrooper was posthumously awarded the George Cross. A labourer in his early 20s from the Falls Road was cleared of a charge of murdering Sergeant Willets. Two months before his death the sergeant was present when soldiers shot dead a civilian, William Halligan, in disputed circumstances on the Falls Road. (McKittrick et al., Lost Lives 74)


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,Tír Chonaill
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 07:26 PM

So he didn't "... lay down on the package and he murmured one farewell to those at home in England to those he loved so well"?

Nor did "They turned towards the soldier their eyes alive with fear
For God's sake save our children or they'll end their short lives here"

Dressed it up a lot Harvey, didn't you?


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 07:33 PM

The word is "based"


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,Tír Chonaill
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 07:42 PM

"And the Irishmen threw down their young and stood before their wives"

That has to be the most insulting sentence I have ever had the displeasure to read

Can you explain what possessed you to write that line, Harvey?

You don't strike me as being a blatant propogandist.

What point am I missing here?

Surely not the same point that all the squaddies who love this song, miss?


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 07:54 PM

Isn't it obvious? They got their children on the floor as fast as they could and stood to protect their wives. The point he's making is that in this situation everyone did the best they could. Unfortunately too many people don't listen to the lyrics but hear them through the distortion of their prejudices. The song is about man's inhumanity to man, and the key line has to be "the nails that pierced his skin". This reference to sacrifice and crucifixion is crucial to understanding the writer's point. The song is not propoganda, it is not on the side of anyone but those caught everyday in the modern world between a rock and a hard place. In the end it's a song of hope that the actions of the parents/husbands and of the soldier perpetuate the good in humanity against the murderous, often religion based lunacy of the few.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,Tír Chonaill
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 08:14 PM

I'm not questioning the sentiment, at all.

I'm questioning the off-handedness of his treatment of the other victims of the bombing.
And the latent accusations of cowardice he levels at them.

Not to mention the song's factuality


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,Tír Chonaill
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 08:18 PM

I have heard Harvey sing this on a live recording, and I know the lines that are emphasised


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 08:28 PM

I'm questioning the off-handedness of his treatment of the other victims of the bombing.
And the latent accusations of cowardice he levels at them

I don't hear this in the lyric.As I say above I hear a song where the only cowards are the one who threw the bomb and the crowd who jeered. The victims do their best no matter what side of the divide you wish to see them on.


In the end it's a song of hope that the actions of the parents/husbands and of the soldier perpetuate the good in humanity against the murderous, often religion based lunacy of the few.

That's what I hear.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,Tír Chonaill
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 09:04 PM

Well then, I think in that case, a lot of the cheering, and banging of tables that I heard at the culmination of that live recording was just other people "hear(ing) them (i.e. the lyric) through the distortion of their prejudices".

I think the recording was from a British Army social club.

Be nice if Harvey was to answer this one.

Unless, of course, you speak for him...


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,Tír Chonaill
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 09:08 PM

'Margarita', on the other hand, has to be one of the finest songs in existence.

'Soldier' troubles me, however.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Aug 05 - 05:12 AM

Well then, I think in that case, a lot of the cheering, and banging of tables that I heard at the culmination of that live recording was just other people "hear(ing) them (i.e. the lyric) through the distortion of their prejudices".

No doubt there's truth in that. It just shows the power of the song (and song in general) to affect people, and emphasises the need of the songwriter to be sure of what he's saying and how he says it. I think the song can be defended because, as you point out, he has written other songs on the same theme with equal passion, "Hey Sandy", "Margarita" "Song for Anne Frank". These are all about the innocent caught up in a madness.
I think the problem with "Soldier" is that he includes the soldier among the innocent, a young man who is a victim of unemployment and good PR. and some people have a problem with this.
However, it's happening again in Iraq where young men have been sent as "liberators" and "peacekeepers" but are finding themselves seen as "occupiers". The mother camped outside Bush's place is making the same point as the song in many ways, claiming her son didn't die defending his country against attack but died as a tool of politics, a man caught between the eternal rock and a hardplace, like the soldier in "Soldier."


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: Wolfgang
Date: 24 Aug 05 - 09:41 AM

What a stupid and pointless way to look at a song.

Should we blame 'Roddy McCorley' for giving the wrong date, 'Loughgall ambush' for not mentioning all people killed, 'Three score and ten' for getting date and numbers wrong and so on?

Should we scrutinise Picasso's 'Guernica' to see if he got a detail wrong, blame Goya for painting only a small fraction of those killed?

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,Tír Chonaill
Date: 24 Aug 05 - 01:16 PM

I think the problem with 'Soldier' is the off-handedness of his treatment of the other victims of the bombing.
And the latent accusations of cowardice he levels at them.

How much is poetic license, how much is singing to the Gallery?

Harvey?


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,Tír Chonaill
Date: 24 Aug 05 - 01:23 PM

I have to say that I heard the recording I'm talking about first about 25 years ago, and have been wanting to know Harvey's thoughts ever since


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,Tír Eoghain
Date: 24 Aug 05 - 02:48 PM

... and the biggest pedant on this forum (Wolfgang) is trying to stop you becoming one, Pete.

Never come across this song before...

..'Endless Civil War'
..' The blind against the blind'

Heavily biased if you ask me.

But you're not asking me..., you're asking the author


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Aug 05 - 03:16 PM

' The blind against the blind'

Classic neutrality!A plague on both your houses etc, etc. But then not to you if you support one side against the other i suppose. Which attitude leads in the end to the death of innocents.
Hopefully, the phrase endless civil war will become redundant soon, but i doubt it somehow. Too many people seem to enjoy their hatred on both sides of the various divides in the world.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Soldier (Harvey Andrews)
From: GUEST,Tír Chonaill
Date: 24 Aug 05 - 10:38 PM

Look Guest, your thoughts are all very interesting (that is if you're the same one who is posting all the time...), but we're getting nowhere here, unless your words are endorsed by Harvey himself.

In case you think I'm taking the piss; I'm not.

That song fuelled many's a squaddie before he went out on foot patrol in the North of Ireland in the early '80's (which, as I say, was the first time I came across the song).

There are many inaccuracies in the song, which (whether you like it or not) causes a certain slant to the message that he obviously is trying to make.

This being so, it really behooves "...the songwriter to be sure of what he's saying and how he says it."

How sure was Harvey..., do you think?


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