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BS: What color is the universe? Beige?

little john cameron 30 Apr 02 - 02:30 PM
SharonA 30 Apr 02 - 12:30 PM
little john cameron 29 Apr 02 - 08:02 PM
The Pooka 29 Apr 02 - 07:42 PM
little john cameron 29 Apr 02 - 07:36 PM
The Pooka 29 Apr 02 - 07:25 PM
SharonA 29 Apr 02 - 05:39 PM
little john cameron 29 Apr 02 - 05:27 PM
Sorcha 29 Apr 02 - 05:25 PM
SharonA 29 Apr 02 - 05:22 PM
Sorcha 29 Apr 02 - 05:14 PM
Catherine Jayne 05 Apr 02 - 01:03 PM
SharonA 05 Apr 02 - 10:24 AM
GUEST 05 Apr 02 - 05:50 AM
Genie 04 Apr 02 - 02:44 PM
mooman 04 Apr 02 - 03:26 AM
mousethief 04 Apr 02 - 03:17 AM
Genie 03 Apr 02 - 11:08 PM
Herga Kitty 30 Mar 02 - 03:09 PM
Genie 30 Mar 02 - 02:22 PM
GUEST 30 Mar 02 - 08:29 AM
Mr Red 17 Mar 02 - 06:56 PM
GUEST 17 Mar 02 - 12:13 AM
The Pooka 16 Mar 02 - 01:03 PM
GUEST 16 Mar 02 - 12:42 PM
GUEST 15 Mar 02 - 05:51 PM
SharonA 15 Mar 02 - 09:28 AM
GUEST 15 Mar 02 - 02:02 AM
JennieG 15 Mar 02 - 01:25 AM
The Pooka 14 Mar 02 - 09:40 PM
GUEST 14 Mar 02 - 01:57 PM
Bob Bolton 14 Mar 02 - 07:12 AM
GUEST 14 Mar 02 - 06:23 AM
Wolfgang 14 Mar 02 - 06:06 AM
GUEST 14 Mar 02 - 02:44 AM
GUEST 14 Mar 02 - 02:31 AM
The Pooka 14 Mar 02 - 01:19 AM
CapriUni 14 Mar 02 - 12:09 AM
Ian Darby 13 Mar 02 - 09:03 PM
Big John 13 Mar 02 - 08:48 PM
JennieG 13 Mar 02 - 06:55 PM
Little Hawk 13 Mar 02 - 04:09 PM
The Pooka 12 Mar 02 - 10:54 PM
GUEST 12 Mar 02 - 09:17 PM
Little Hawk 12 Mar 02 - 08:25 PM
Mr Red 12 Mar 02 - 07:55 PM
RichM 12 Mar 02 - 06:34 PM
Bob Bolton 12 Mar 02 - 04:11 PM
MMario 12 Mar 02 - 03:49 PM
SharonA 12 Mar 02 - 03:20 PM
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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: little john cameron
Date: 30 Apr 02 - 02:30 PM

Hmmm,logical conclusion Sharon.Ah think the treed wis aboot Tartan,tho it wis a while ago.Ah'l hae a look for it.ljc


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: SharonA
Date: 30 Apr 02 - 12:30 PM

Would somebody pleeeeeze tell the rest of the class what thread you're talking about? Maybe make a blueclickeything so we can go look at it?? Thanks!

Anyway, the Universe couldn't possibly have a clan tartan, could it? ...unless you consider everything and everyone in it to be a member of one universal clan... but then, you wouldn't need a clan tartan for identification....


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: little john cameron
Date: 29 Apr 02 - 08:02 PM

Ah'll post a bit aboot them efter mah denner. ljc


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: The Pooka
Date: 29 Apr 02 - 07:42 PM

Well I'll be damned. The Sobieski Brithers, is it? OK ljc, I'll look for mair aboot it an th' ither threed. / Big Green Grin.


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: little john cameron
Date: 29 Apr 02 - 07:36 PM

That Tartan business is a bunch o' rubbish.We never had clan tartans as such,that is a fairly modern invention by the Sobieski Brithers.There is mair aboot this oan an earlier threed.ljc


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: The Pooka
Date: 29 Apr 02 - 07:25 PM

Been awa' an' missed the other thread; but -- will ye reveal to us the Universe's Tartan, ljc? :) *BOG* (Big Orange Grin)


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: SharonA
Date: 29 Apr 02 - 05:39 PM

I figured as much, hence the *G* at the end of my post! *bigger G*


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: little john cameron
Date: 29 Apr 02 - 05:27 PM

Ah Cosmic telepathy Sharon. Thankee kindly Sorcha.ljc


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: Sorcha
Date: 29 Apr 02 - 05:25 PM

He asked in another thread for someone to find this one....


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: SharonA
Date: 29 Apr 02 - 05:22 PM

Where? I don't see him. *G*


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: Sorcha
Date: 29 Apr 02 - 05:14 PM

Here ya are, LJC!


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: Catherine Jayne
Date: 05 Apr 02 - 01:03 PM

GREEN!!!!!! and if its not it should be!!!!!!LOL!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: SharonA
Date: 05 Apr 02 - 10:24 AM

They wouldn't have known about monitors per se but I know what you're saying, GUEST, about the use of individual colors juxtapositioned to create the same sort of perception of overall color that the brain perceives from signals transmitted by the retina.

I have to point out, though, that Claude Monet and Georges Seurat went about creating this perception in markedly different ways, and were leaders of two different (though related) artistic movements. Monet, of course, is the archetypal Impressionist (in fact, "Impression: Sunrise" gave Impressionism its name); Impressionists tried to portray visual reality accurately in terms of transient light and color. Georges-Pierre Seurat was the founder and leader of the Neo-Impressionist movement known for using Pointillism (a.k.a. Divisionism: a technique of painting tiny, detached brush strokes of different colors); pointillists were less concerned with realism than with illusion (such as portraying linear structure without lines).

But artists of both movements were pioneers; if they hadn't dared to think and paint in a way that defied centuries-old assumptions about the way we see, we might have had to wait a lot longer for the monitor and the pixel to be part of our everyday lives.


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Apr 02 - 05:50 AM

If you take a good eye piece 10 to 15X and look at the monitor screne you will see it is made up of three colors and black, Serraut and Monet knew this.


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: Genie
Date: 04 Apr 02 - 02:44 PM

Alex, does that make you "un ladrón de raton?"


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: mooman
Date: 04 Apr 02 - 03:26 AM

As it's infinite I can't imagine it's infinitely beige because that would be infinitely boring. There must be some stripes and polka dots surely? Does anyone know what colour superstrings are?

mooman


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: mousethief
Date: 04 Apr 02 - 03:17 AM

Raton is Spanish for mouse (for what THAT's worth). Rata is Spanish for rat. Topo is indeed Italian for mouse. Which explains what a topographical map is: one with lines so tiny and close together, it looks like it was drawn by a mouse. Or not.

The universe, as one of our guests rightly pointed out, is far and away more black than anything else, as can be readily observed on a cloudless night. If you're only averaging the stars, you're leaving out the bigger part of what is to be seen when one looks at the universe. If they averaged in all the black between and behind and around the stars, too, you might get a very sickly shade of grayish black. But probably too close to black to make much fuss over.

Alex


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: Genie
Date: 03 Apr 02 - 11:08 PM

Well, Pooka and Bob, it looks like "vous avez raison et j'ai tort." I've checked a number of sources and they all say "mouse" is "souris" and "taupe" is "mole." Alors, pardonnez-moi.

Re color, though, it's pretty much the same thing.

Herga, if you had a chap from Kuwait toting a certain kind and color of guitar around, he could be "a Kurd and a Guild of beige," right?

Genie
[running for cover]


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 30 Mar 02 - 03:09 PM

For many years we had a radio programme running on the BBC Home Service/ Radio 4 called "My Word", with Frank Muir and Dennis Norden. Towards the end, each of them had to rework a well-known phrase or saying. I think it was Dennis Norden who came up with the one about redecorating the scriptwriters' union room so it was "only a guild in a curdled beige"....


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: Genie
Date: 30 Mar 02 - 02:22 PM

Pooka,
"Taupe" may very well refer to a mole, but I'm pretty sure it can also refer to a mouse.

FWIW, "topo" in Italiano means "mouse."  [Mickey Mouse, e.g., in Roma is "Topolino"--little mouse, and many of us remember Topo Gigio from the Ed Sullivan show.]

Bob B, You're right that "souris" means mouse in French, but I could swear that you also can use "taupe," although it may be a less specific term for small rodents.  [Some languages don't distinguish among rodents as much as English does.  E.g., they may use the same word for "rat" and "mouse," and maybe "mole" as well. I've also heard some French speakers use "raton" for "mouse," though it may more appropriately refer to a rat.  A racoon [sp?] is sometimes called a "raton laveur" or "washer rat."]

I don't have my French dictionary with me right now, so I'll have to do futher research on this later unless there's a French expert Chat-de-[however you say "Mud" in French] out there who beats me to it.

Genie


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Mar 02 - 08:29 AM

from space most call us azure but i prefer teal


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: Mr Red
Date: 17 Mar 02 - 06:56 PM

Apologies to God but as a hue-man-ist what I say is:
Red sky in the morning, Mr Red's warning,  Red sky at night – your cottage is on fire.


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Mar 02 - 12:13 AM

Pink and its triangular


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: The Pooka
Date: 16 Mar 02 - 01:03 PM

GUEST, thanks. JennieG and I are memorizing the table of pure spectral coordinates now. Almost done. :)

JennieG - Herrrrrrre, Yeller! Come back Yeller!...(OKOK, so that one's a Dog, so sue me. Just crying Woof here.)

Now don't get me wrong, this ain't meant as racism, just Hue-ism (Pure Spectrumism?) -

Why do them yellow girls love me so?
A-waaaay, Santy Anno!
Because I don't tell 'em All I Know**
All on the plains of Mexico!

(**Actually I did tell 'em; but after *that* 3 or 4 minutes, the conversation lagged...)

Yellow Rules the Wavelengths.

Green's nice too. Also, I'm gonna place an Orange order.

- Gandalf the White


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: GUEST
Date: 16 Mar 02 - 12:42 PM

huh


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Mar 02 - 05:51 PM

Quantative specification of colors is done via coordinates in the CIE chromaticity diagram.
x, y and z are the coordinates and x+y+z=1.
White is 1/3,1/3,1/3. Standard wavelengths are;
435.8 millimicrons (Hg blue emission line) with x = .16658, y = .00886, z =.82456
546.1 millimicrons (Hg green emission line) with x = .27376, y = .71741, and z= .00883
700.0 millimicrons with x = .73467, y = .26533, z = 0.00000

A table of the coordinates of the pure spectral colors is in the AIP Handbook and the Handbook of Chemistry and Physics (among other places).

The colors of the CIE chromaticity diagram. Diagram in color

Black and white only, but fuller explaination. Diagram


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: SharonA
Date: 15 Mar 02 - 09:28 AM

GUEST: Y'mean like Ted Turner's colorized movies? *G*


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Mar 02 - 02:02 AM

All any pure one spectral color is ghastly! Think about taking all your black and white photos and changing white to a bright yellow, and dustier white to grays to just dirty yellows. It's terrible. It's just black and white with the white switched to something else.


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: JennieG
Date: 15 Mar 02 - 01:25 AM

Well I thank the scientists that gave us the internet! And I am sure the other stuff is fascinating too if I could only understand it - I did well in English at school but not so well in science. CapriUni I love those words - I'm sticking to my yellow universe, my yellow universe......they call me mellow yellow.......yellow is the colour of my true love's hair......etc.....
Cheers
JennieG - I think I got the < and > thingies round the right way this time -


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: The Pooka
Date: 14 Mar 02 - 09:40 PM

G'day again to yerself Bob Bolton, and *LOL*! Rats in the Ranks, to be SURE! I guess some rather rodentine individuals can be found lurkin' in th' oul' Elective Orifices, all the wide wurruld around.

Thank you too, btw, for a post I can *understand*, amidst the aforegoing forthholdings of the FizzyCysts. -- Now don'tcha be commencin' to Fizz, ye learned ladies and/or gentlemen of science; I hereby stipulate that anti-intellectual mockery & rejectionism is the last refuge of morons like me, OK? But what else can we do? We read and really TRY to understand; but there's a Mental Block. (Say what? Aaah shaddup.) All I know is, it's Yellow. (J'ever notice how much we like to say "All I Know Is..."? That has a deeper meaning, y'know. But never mind.)

All right then: what will be the sun's color when it becomes a white dwarf? Hmmph? Oh. Yeah I guess that *is* a bit Grant's Tombish. Plus it invites Sneezey and Dopey jokes. Especially Dopey. // OKOK here's one: what is the color of a black hole's hair? Hah! Trick question.


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Mar 02 - 01:57 PM

Hue, brightness, and saturation are the basis for the description of a psychological sensation of color, but the last I knew none of these parameters were defined quantitatively. The primary colors are red, blue, and green and the subractive ones are yellow, cyan, and magenta, where the last two are obviously not pure spectrum colors, but the first four are not defined quantatively in terms of a range of spectrum colors from any given source of radiation.

We could undoubtably make the system work for primary colors and yellow by chosing spectrum colors for blue, green, red and yellow, but that doesn't mean that the choices we make are the only possible ones that would fit the loose definitions.

It's perhaps unfortunate that the term 'color' is used in both the psychological system and the physical one loosely describing a wavelength of visible light (spectrum color).


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 14 Mar 02 - 07:12 AM

G'day again Pooka,

Thanks for the update on the American rodent/politician situation.

Here in the Antipodes, the average pollie is a more of a slightly larger rodent. A famous documentary film on my local council was called (quite appropriately!) Rats inthe Ranks.

Regard(les)s,

Bob Bolton


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Mar 02 - 06:23 AM

Wolfgang, I can't figure out what might be called an meaningful 'average' [Even with the complication I left out above, the eye's photopic luminous sensitivity as a function of power at each wavelength.]

'Average' gets hard to define for any function that starts at some x = 0 where y = 0 then goes to some x where y is higher, then goes back to x = anything where y = 0. A lot can be calculated, for example, from the bell curve (gaussian distribution), but it's 'average' is something divided by 2 times infinity, which is nothing. Color as a pure spectral one is easily define by wavelength, but white to black aren't colors, and most things we see aren't pure spectral colors, and what colors we see depend on whats illuminating them. A spectrally pure blue object under illumination by a yellow sodium lamp will appear black (no color sensation visible to the eye).


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: Wolfgang
Date: 14 Mar 02 - 06:06 AM

So what color is the Universe?

Really the answer is so close to white, it is difficult to say

is the authors' response here. From what I still know and what GUEST writes this is more or less identical to the colour of our sun. That sounds much better than the 'turquoise' they had announced last year.

There are some things in your lifes you can decide or at least influence yourselfes, like e.g. colour of your car, name of your child. And there are some things you cannot choose according to your wishes. It helps to know the difference.

Wolfgang

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Mar 02 - 02:44 AM

Wolfgang, that's the technical way. There's a very simple way to get the average color of the sun. White is the reflection of all colors of the sun with the same reflection coefficient for each color. Hence the average 'color' of the sun is white. An ordinary light bulb has a color temperture of about 3200 Kelvins, and is a bit on the yellowish side. JennieG, use nothing but bright candles and you'll get your yellow world, less bright candles will give you a reddish one.


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Mar 02 - 02:31 AM

MMario, quit those clicky things! You'll give those here a dose of reality they're obviously not prepared to handle.

Wolfgang, the sun has a radiation spectrum that is pretty close to that of a 5500 Kelvin black body. How do you want to define average? Half the distance from one end of the visible spectrum to the other, or an average weighted by the energy in a constant narrow wavelength band (X/per Angstrom), or an average weighted by constant energy in a small energy band (X/wavenmber). At any rate to do it quantatively you've got to do it with X = power per unit emittance area or X = photons per unit emittance area, and these will give different averages in each case above (we can ignore the solid angle here because that will be determined by the ratio of the radius of the pupil of the eye to the distance to the sun).

Total normal incident energy on the earth with sun directly overhead, and no clouds or significant polution, is about 1350 watts per square meter (measured, not calulated from effective color temperture).

JennieG, those dreary scientists, with a little help from engineers, brought to us the internet, which gives one unprecedented power to distribute one's ignorance at nearly the speed of light, 299,792,458 meters per second.


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: The Pooka
Date: 14 Mar 02 - 01:19 AM

Little Hawk - "...The thing is, why go and fight over something real when you can fight over complete illusions? And it's good for the economy too... " RIGHT ON, MAN! And it doesn't *kill* anybody eiher! All We Are Saying Is, Give Illusory War A Chance.

JennieG, I'll vote with Yue on the Hue.

- Old Yeller


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: CapriUni
Date: 14 Mar 02 - 12:09 AM

JennieG--

"We all live in a yellow universe, a yellow universe, a yellow universe!"

Personally, I like all the colors! And I'm keepin' 'em!


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: Ian Darby
Date: 13 Mar 02 - 09:03 PM

I thought it was Puce.


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: Big John
Date: 13 Mar 02 - 08:48 PM

Why trouble Hubble, Just check out any bubble, Let it bob and float and wobble, You'll see rainbows on the double.


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: JennieG
Date: 13 Mar 02 - 06:55 PM

I don't know why it can't be yellow - I like yellow - can your own universe be whatever colour you want it to be? Or does it have to be what some dreary scientist in his little lab somewhere on the other side of the world says it is?
Cheers >br>JennieG in her yellow universe.......


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 13 Mar 02 - 04:09 PM

Ha! This thread just keeps getting better all the time. I can forsee some major wars arising soon over this "What color is the universe" debate, and all kinds of possiblities for martial glory of a kind not seen since the Crusades. Have at the infidels, I say!

The Rolling Stones may agree that the Universe is black...or at least should be. The song "Paint It Black" comes to mind. Disaffected teenagers in my hometown of Orillia also seem to favour black as the basic color...if black can be called a color at all.

"Black" people, of course, are not black in the first place...nor am I white...but what's the use in trying to get anywhere with that argument?

The thing is, why go and fight over something real when you can fight over complete illusions? And it's good for the economy too...

- LH


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: The Pooka
Date: 12 Mar 02 - 10:54 PM

God may be a Committee, a Smart Decorator, and All Thangs Great & Small. However, according to Einstein, She "does not play dice." Uncle Albert just wasn't too sure about Uncertainty, y'see. Didn't wanna make that Quantum leap. So evidently God is omnipresent, with the exception of Las Vegas. Now what this has to do wih the Universal Hue I'll *never* know but I say Yeah! let' keep this unmoored thread a-drift! Belay that anchor! Avast them scuppers & batten down the mainmast! Ha-HARRR! We'll creep if we want to, see? After all, are we Moles or are we Mice?
Bob Bolton, nous avons les officiales mousee ici dans l'Amerique aussi, aussie. As writer David Barry so patriotically put it, "They're all idiots and I stand behind them 100%." But Vice President Cheney is our Main Mole. He's always in an underground bunker somewhere. What fear, y'know. (Fear of what, you ask? Fear Itself, sez I.)


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Mar 02 - 09:17 PM

Mustabin a Honkey who thought that one up. Just look at the night sky and you'll see that the universe is BLACK.


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 12 Mar 02 - 08:25 PM

God is all thangs...therefer She is both a committee and a singularity. She's fer ya and agin' ya. She's a atheist and a bible-thumpin', hellfire n' brimstone EEEvangelist! She's thuh up, thuh down, and thuh inbetween, plus the up-the-wazoo-sideways! She is and she ain't. She were, she warn't, and she will be.

And so is He!

Confusionatin' ain't it? Ah'm gonna hev me s'more moonshine an' ferfit 'bout thuh whole thang if'n Ah kin!

- LH


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: Mr Red
Date: 12 Mar 02 - 07:55 PM

Reminds me of the story of why the senior lecturer's common room at a certain Uni was beige.
It was the only colour a committee could agree on!
Is God a committee? Surely she is not!


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: RichM
Date: 12 Mar 02 - 06:34 PM

Beige goes with EVERYTHING.
The Creator is a smart decorator.

Rich McCarthy


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 12 Mar 02 - 04:11 PM

G'day Sonja and Pook,

I sem to remember (about the nearest I get to actually remembering ...) the French for mouse being souris. We had a local (New South Wales - Australian state) politician appropriately so surnamed!

Regards,

Bob Bolton


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: MMario
Date: 12 Mar 02 - 03:49 PM

chart of our suns output relative to some others

a representation of sol's spectrum


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Subject: RE: BS: What color is the universe? Beige?
From: SharonA
Date: 12 Mar 02 - 03:20 PM

By all means, let the thread creep where it will! I'm already amazed that it's up to 47 posts so far!!!


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