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Lyr Req: This Is No My Ain House (Jacobite song)

DigiTrad:
YE JACOBITES BY NAME


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In Mudcat MIDIs:
This Is No Ma Ain Hoose (Midi made from the notation in Burns: Poems and Songs (James Kinsley, OUP 1969))


GUEST,Mo 28 Oct 00 - 07:48 AM
GUEST,rabbitrunning 28 Oct 00 - 09:15 AM
Malcolm Douglas 28 Oct 00 - 12:51 PM
GUEST,Bruce O. 28 Oct 00 - 02:39 PM
GUEST,Mo McGregor 30 Oct 00 - 06:00 AM
Jon W. 30 Oct 00 - 11:15 AM
Malcolm Douglas 30 Oct 00 - 07:52 PM
GUEST,CraigS 31 Oct 00 - 03:00 AM
Malcolm Douglas 31 Oct 00 - 10:26 AM
Jack Campin 15 Jun 07 - 05:30 PM
Jim McLean 16 Jun 07 - 05:18 AM
GUEST,Padruig 16 Jun 07 - 11:32 AM
Jack Campin 16 Jun 07 - 01:28 PM
McGrath of Harlow 16 Jun 07 - 01:38 PM
GUEST,Padruig 16 Jun 07 - 01:57 PM
Jack Campin 16 Jun 07 - 08:05 PM
McGrath of Harlow 17 Jun 07 - 01:45 PM
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Subject: Jacobite rebellion song
From: GUEST,Mo
Date: 28 Oct 00 - 07:48 AM

Hi!

I'm looking for the lyrics to a Jacobite rebellion song, the title of which I think is "This is no ma ain hoose". It was sung by Ewan MacColl and recorded late 70s or early 80s on an album of Jacobite rebellion songs.

The song is about not recognizing Scotland as "ma ain hoose" after the failure of the Jacobite rebellion.

Can anybody help??

Mo McGregor


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Jacobite rebellion song
From: GUEST,rabbitrunning
Date: 28 Oct 00 - 09:15 AM

It's in the Digitrad, here with the title "This is No Ma Ain Hoose" (in case the link doesn't work.)


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Subject: Lyr Add: THIS IS NO MA AIN HOOSE
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 28 Oct 00 - 12:51 PM

The version on the DT is a children's song (hence the use of hoose, where tune and song are -historically- usually spelt house).  Here is a more complete version, from Jacobite Songs and Ballads, ed. G.S. MacQuoid (date unknown):


THIS IS NO MY AIN HOUSE

Chorus:

O This is no my ain house,
I ken by the biggin o't;
For bow-kail thrave at my door cheek
And thistles on the riggin o't.

A carle came wi' lack o' grace,
Wi' unco gear and unco face;
And sin he claimed my daddy's; place,
I downa bide the triggin o't.

W' routh o' kin and routh o' reek,
My daddy's door it wadna steek;
But bread and cheese were his door cheek,
And girdle cakes the riggin o't.

My daddy bag his housie weel,
By dint o' head and dint o' heel,
By dint o' arm and dint o' steel,
And muckle weary priggin o't.

Then was it dink, or was it douce
For ony cringing foreign goose
To claucht my daddie's wee bit house,
Ans spoil the hamely triggin o't?

Say, was it foul, or was it fair,
To come a hunder mile and mair,
For to ding out my daddy's heir,
And dash him wi' the whiggin o't?


It may well be a re-write of an earlier song.  Burns was familiar with the melody, and set his This is no my ain lassie to it.  Alan Ramsay re-made it as a love-song, which not everybody considered an improvement:


THIS IS NO MINE AIN HOUSE.

(Alan Ramsay, 1686-1758)

This is no mine ain house,
I ken by the rigging o't;
Since with my love I've changed vows,
I dinna like the bigging o't.
For now that I'm young Robbie's bride,
And mistress of his fire-side,
Mine ain house I'll like to guide,
And please me with the rigging o't.

Then fareweel to my father's house,
I gang whare love invites me;
The strictest duty this allows,
When love with honour meets me.
When Hymen moulds us into ane,
My Robbie's dearer than my kin;
And to refuse him were a sin,
Sae lang's he kindly treats me.

When I'm in my ain house,
True love shall be at hand aye,
To make me still a prudent spouse,
And let my man command aye;
Avoiding ilka cause of strife,
The common pest of married life,
That maks ane wearied of his wife,
And breaks the kindly band aye.


Malcolm


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Jacobite rebellion song
From: GUEST,Bruce O.
Date: 28 Oct 00 - 02:39 PM

The children's song in DT is much older than the source cited there. Wm. Stenhouse gave it, calling it an old 'nursery ditty', in 'Illustrations to the Scots Musical Musuem', #237, and said that it was the original from which Allan Ramsay borrowed a line or two. SMM #237 is Allan Ramsay's song, but set to the tune "Deil Stick the Minister", rather than "This is no my ain house". Both tunes are 17th century ones.

The Jacobite song is given in James Hogg's 'Jacobite Relics', I, #37, 1819, but is given rather curiously, with chorus first (O this is no my ain house) and then 1st first verse (A carle came wi' lack o' grace) set to music, after which are printed the rest of the verses, with the chorus noted to be sung after each verse.

I suspect the Jacobite song was one of Hogg's own. Hogg in his notes said "...; but I really expect that the publication of these Jacobite relics will work a revolution in Scottish song, and that, for a time, we shall hear them more generally sung than any other." If the song were known earlier, then it seems that 'revolution in Scottish song' would have already past.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Jacobite rebellion song
From: GUEST,Mo McGregor
Date: 30 Oct 00 - 06:00 AM

Many thanks for the replies, and for the lyrics! This site is great for obtaining info and as I am working in Kosovo, where info on Scottish songs is difficult to come by, I'll know where to post a request in future if I can't find what I'm looking for in the Digitrad.

Thanks again

Mo McGregor


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Jacobite rebellion song
From: Jon W.
Date: 30 Oct 00 - 11:15 AM

I've got a copy of MacColl's recording mentioned by Mo and I've always wondered at the meaning of this song - it seems by far the hardest to understand (with "Cam Ye O'er frae France?" in second place and "Donald MacIllavrey" in third) for me as an American. Can anyone provide a translation from Braid Scots to English and explain some of the allusions i.e. bread, cheese, and girdle cakes?


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Jacobite rebellion song
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 30 Oct 00 - 07:52 PM

OK, Jon, here is a bit of a glossary.  John of Brisbane, incidentally, has posted an extensive  Glossary of Scottish Words  which you will find useful.

biggin = building
bow-kail =cabbage
door cheek = threshold, door-post
riggin = roof
carle = man
unco = foreign
I downa bide = I can't abide
triggin = decoration
routh = plenty
kin = possibly, in this context, kindling?
reek = smoke
steek = shut, fasten
girdle cakes are oatcakes baked on a girdle (a circular iron plate). I assume that this, and the references to bread and cheese, are symbolic.
bag = built
muckle =(in this context) very
priggin = haggling, bargaining
dink = nice
douce = kind
claught = grab
wee bit = little
ding out = drive out
dash = dismay
whiggin = I'm guessing that this is coined from the term Whig, a Covenanter or Presbyterian, and presumably means "presbyterianisation"!

NB W' in verse 2 should of course be Wi'

Malcolm


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Jacobite rebellion song
From: GUEST,CraigS
Date: 31 Oct 00 - 03:00 AM

The word "whig" meant a thief, particularly a horse thief (a hanging offence, one might add).

The last verse therefore means "Is it fair to throw a man from the house which he has inherited from his father while damning him for stealing it in the first place?"


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Jacobite rebellion song
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 31 Oct 00 - 10:26 AM

Sounds good to me; thanks, Craig.

Malcolm


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Jacobite rebellion song
From: Jack Campin
Date: 15 Jun 07 - 05:30 PM

If there ever was a sense of "whig" that meant "horse thief", it was an antiquarian irrelevance by the time Hogg wrote that song. No Scots or English dictionary I've seen mentions it.

From the OED it looks like the older sense of the word was "country bumpkin" and it was a derisive term applied to the Protestants of rural south-west Scotland at the time they rose to power in the 17th century. There is a *possibility* that the "bumpkin" meaning came about from another sense of the word meaning "whey" - i.e. metonymically somebody so poor that whey was a major part of their diet - but that's fairly conjectural.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Jacobite rebellion song
From: Jim McLean
Date: 16 Jun 07 - 05:18 AM

There may be a confusion here regarding Whig and Tory who were in opposition to each other politically. In Ireland, I have always heard the word Tory to mean a 'rustler' or cattle thief.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Jacobite rebellion song
From: GUEST,Padruig
Date: 16 Jun 07 - 11:32 AM

The word Tories was originally used to describe rural bandits in Ireland. In the 17th century it had become a term applied to monarchists in the House of Commons. By the 18th century the Tories were politicians who favoured royal authority, the established church and who sought to preserve the traditional political structure and opposed parliamentary reform. After 1834 this political group in the House of Commons preferred to use the term Conservative.
From www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Jacobite rebellion song
From: Jack Campin
Date: 16 Jun 07 - 01:28 PM

... except in Scotland where the Tories sided with the *dis*established church.

The way the divisions played out in Scotland was generally that the Tories were the party of the landed aristocracy and the Whigs were the party of the legal elite and the urban bourgeoisie. The Kirk was reduced to passivity after the Porteous Riots of 1737; mostly they clung on to the Whigs while having repeated schisms triggered by attempts by the Tories and the English to subordinate them to the state.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Jacobite rebellion song
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 16 Jun 07 - 01:38 PM

From Brewers dictionary of Phrase and Fable 1898:

Whig is from Whiggam-more, a corruption of Ugham-more (pack-saddle thieves), from the Celtic ugham (a pack-saddle). The Scotch insurgent Covenanters were called pack-saddle thieves, from the pack-saddles which they used to employ for the stowage of plunder. The Marquis of Argyle collected a band of these vagabonds, and instigated them to aid him in opposing certain government measures in the reign of James I., and in the reign of Charles II. all who opposed government were called the Argyle whiggamors, contracted into whigs.

"The south-west counties of Scotland have seldom corn enough to serve them all the year round, and, the northern parts producing more than they used, those in the west went in summer to buy at Leith the stores that came from the north. From the word whiggam, used in driving their horses, all that drove were called the whiggamors, contracted into whigs. Now, in the year before the news came down of Duke Hamilton's defeat, the ministers animated their people to rise and march to Edinburgh; and they came up, marching on the head of their parishes, with an unheard-of fury, praying and preaching all the way as they came. The Marquis of Argyle and his party came and headed them, they being about 6,000. This was called the "Whiggamors' Inroad"; and ever after that, all who opposed the court came in contempt to be called whigs. From Scotland the word was brought into England, where it is now one of our unhappy terms of disunion."—Bishop Burnet: Own Times.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Jacobite rebellion song
From: GUEST,Padruig
Date: 16 Jun 07 - 01:57 PM

Also from From Brewers dictionary of Phrase and Fable 1898:
Tory: This word, says Defoe, is the Irish toruigh, used in the reign of Queen Elizabeth to signify a band of Catholic outlaws who haunted the bogs of Ireland. it is formed from the verb toruighim (to make sudden raids). Golius says -"TORY, sivestrus, montana,avis, homo,et ultrumqueullus haud ibi est" (Whatever inhabits mountains and forests is a Tory). Lord Macaulay says - "The name was first given to those who refused to concur in excluding James from the throne," He further says - "The bogs or Ireland afforded a refuge to Popish outlaws, called tories." Tory hunting was a pastime has has even found place in our nursery rhymes - "I went to the wood and killed a tory".
F. Crossley gives as the derivation, Taobh-riogh (Celtic), "king's party."
H.T.Hore, in Notes and Queries, gives Tuath-righ, "partisans of the king."
G. Borrow gives Tar-a-ri, "Come, O king."


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Jacobite rebellion song
From: Jack Campin
Date: 16 Jun 07 - 08:05 PM

The OED says "whig" is attested decades before "whiggamore". Brewer's derivation was the urban folklore one for a long time but seems to be wrong.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Jacobite rebellion song
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 17 Jun 07 - 01:45 PM

Quite likely so, but I can't imagine "whiggin" in that song could in that context mean anything other than stealing of some sort or another.


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