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BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?

Backwoodsman 19 Feb 19 - 10:58 AM
Mossback 19 Feb 19 - 10:08 AM
KarenH 19 Feb 19 - 10:03 AM
Backwoodsman 19 Feb 19 - 08:13 AM
Raggytash 19 Feb 19 - 07:38 AM
Steve Shaw 19 Feb 19 - 07:35 AM
Dave the Gnome 19 Feb 19 - 07:23 AM
Jim Carroll 19 Feb 19 - 07:12 AM
Nigel Parsons 19 Feb 19 - 06:58 AM
Iains 18 Feb 19 - 01:54 PM
Steve Shaw 18 Feb 19 - 01:43 PM
Jim Carroll 18 Feb 19 - 01:29 PM
Iains 18 Feb 19 - 12:46 PM
Dave the Gnome 18 Feb 19 - 12:26 PM
bobad 18 Feb 19 - 12:16 PM
Iains 18 Feb 19 - 12:16 PM
Jim Carroll 18 Feb 19 - 11:31 AM
Raggytash 18 Feb 19 - 10:09 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Feb 19 - 08:28 AM
DMcG 18 Feb 19 - 07:01 AM
Raggytash 18 Feb 19 - 06:47 AM
Steve Shaw 18 Feb 19 - 05:54 AM
DMcG 18 Feb 19 - 05:42 AM
Raggytash 18 Feb 19 - 05:36 AM
Iains 18 Feb 19 - 05:30 AM
Steve Shaw 17 Feb 19 - 07:49 PM
McGrath of Harlow 17 Feb 19 - 07:20 PM
DMcG 17 Feb 19 - 06:25 PM
DMcG 17 Feb 19 - 06:23 PM
Backwoodsman 17 Feb 19 - 04:33 PM
Backwoodsman 17 Feb 19 - 04:32 PM
Dave the Gnome 17 Feb 19 - 04:30 PM
Raggytash 17 Feb 19 - 04:26 PM
Iains 17 Feb 19 - 03:01 PM
Raggytash 17 Feb 19 - 02:49 PM
Raggytash 17 Feb 19 - 02:48 PM
Raggytash 17 Feb 19 - 02:22 PM
Iains 17 Feb 19 - 01:22 PM
DMcG 17 Feb 19 - 01:00 PM
Iains 17 Feb 19 - 12:31 PM
Jim Carroll 17 Feb 19 - 11:53 AM
Iains 17 Feb 19 - 10:15 AM
DMcG 17 Feb 19 - 08:11 AM
Iains 17 Feb 19 - 06:48 AM
Steve Shaw 17 Feb 19 - 05:40 AM
DMcG 17 Feb 19 - 05:15 AM
Backwoodsman 17 Feb 19 - 04:54 AM
DMcG 17 Feb 19 - 04:40 AM
DMcG 17 Feb 19 - 04:39 AM
Iains 17 Feb 19 - 04:27 AM
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 19 Feb 19 - 10:58 AM

Mossback - I'm fortunate to have a decent brain, and I'm prepared to use it. I wouldn't vote for either. ;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Mossback
Date: 19 Feb 19 - 10:08 AM

BW, I'm curious who you would vote for in a a stupid, feeble-minded cunt contest: your in denial Brexshiteers, or our in denial Trumpistas.

Or is this more of a 'primus inter pares' sort of thing?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: KarenH
Date: 19 Feb 19 - 10:03 AM

Ians said that there would be no food tariffs post Brexit. Gove says otherwise. Lamb and beef almost certainly. Possibly cereals. Aha, it's a good job we don't live on potato, though it looks as if some of us may do so in the future?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 19 Feb 19 - 08:13 AM

In fairness though, and trying to be fair to the 'in denial' Brexshiteers, it must be very hard to face facts and publicly admit you've been completely sucked-in by a campaign of deceit masterminded by a tiny cadre of immensely-wealthy tax-avoiders and, as a result, behaved like a stupid, feeble-minded cunt.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 19 Feb 19 - 07:38 AM

You may be correct on this one Nigel.

I did notice you didn't post anything a word when I said that one of my insurance companies was relocating some of it's operations to Germany though.

I did notice you didn't post anything when I posted that Nissan was not going to product it's new model in Sunderland, due in part to Brexit.

I did notice you didn't post anything when I posted about other Insurance and Banking organisations relocating some of their operations to Ireland.

Bit of a pattern forming here ...........??


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 19 Feb 19 - 07:35 AM

Not much talk any more about those golden opportunities post-brexit either. Doctor Liam hasn't done very well, has he, apart from ensuring cheaper cuckoo clocks. And I can't imagine things will get much better if we continue to piss Trump off over failed jihadi fighters and send warships to float past China.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Feb 19 - 07:23 AM

It's just brexiteers in denial, Jim. Knowing that they have lost the 'everything is going to be ok' argument they have moved on to 'the news is all that bad' and 'it's nothing to do with brexit anyway'. Why they just can't admit they were wrong is beyond me.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Feb 19 - 07:12 AM

What the hell else are they to say Nigel ?
HONDA ARE NOT THE ONLY ONES - PLENTY MORE TO COME
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 19 Feb 19 - 06:58 AM

The announcement by Honda can be found Here

Here is part of the announcement:
Katsushi Inoue, Chief Officer for European Regional Operations, Honda Motor Co., Ltd., and President, Honda Motor Europe said; "In light of the unprecedented changes that are affecting our industry, it is vital that we accelerate our electrification strategy and restructure our global operations accordingly. As a result, we have had to take this difficult decision to consult our workforce on how we might prepare our manufacturing network for the future. This has not been taken lightly and we deeply regret how unsettling today's announcement will be for our people."
. . .
Honda's European HQ will continue to be located in the UK. It will be focused on serving the needs of our European customers.

This gives a good reason for the restructuring (and thus the closure of the plant) and does not mention Brexit.
This is not selective quoting. The rest of the page doesn't mention Brexit either.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 18 Feb 19 - 01:54 PM

They should stand down and fight by-elections.
Hows about first getting shot of Fiona Onasanya as MP.
Priorities me boy, Priorities!


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Feb 19 - 01:43 PM

Closing Swindon has repercussions far beyond the loss of the 3500 jobs. There are disruptions to supply chains with other manufacturers and there's the loss of skills, not to speak of the social consequences in the town. Thatcher enticed the Japanese carmakers here, promising them an illustrious market and the free flow of materials. We've ditched that promise via brexit so they're ditching us. That was never daubed on the side of a bus, was it? I've gone against my own grain and decided to back another referendum. The country will vote remain and that's the only way we're going to stop the country being wrecked. The seven MPs are despicable and totally unprincipled. They all used party money to campaign and they all used the party structure to get elected, and they all stood on the Labour manifesto and they all increased their majority. They should stand down and fight by-elections. I wish them a miserable oblivion.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Feb 19 - 01:29 PM

The reasons given for their resignation was Antisemitism and Brexit
I have no intention of censoring the news report - I suggest nobody else tries to

Honda is now closing down its British branch because of Brexit Branch
No doubt we will now be told that they are crap cars
Jim


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 18 Feb 19 - 12:46 PM

I believe Jim first raised the issue. Why not take it up with him?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Feb 19 - 12:26 PM

Israel has nothing to do with brexit. I know that Eurovision is from Tel Aviv this year but, trust me, that is nothing to do with the EU. If you want to discuss Israel, start a different thread.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: bobad
Date: 18 Feb 19 - 12:16 PM

Seven right wing Labour politicians (4 with direct links to Israel) have left the Labour Party with a view to forming their own party

“I am leaving behind a culture of bullying, bigotry and intimidation,”

There you have it in a nutshell.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 18 Feb 19 - 12:16 PM

I've always thought that any MP who stood and got elected on a party ticket, supported by party workers and party money, then left the party, should step down as an MP as well. They are there under false pretences.

By extension this should also apply to all those MPs elected on a brexit ticket and now busy betraying it.

No doubt your whimsy will find a way to weasel out and refute the suggestion.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Feb 19 - 11:31 AM

"Strong rumours that Honda are to quit the UK "
Must have an abscess
As they say Abscess makes the fart go "Honda"
Jim


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 18 Feb 19 - 10:09 AM

Strong rumours that Honda are to quit the UK post Brexit and close their Swindon factory in 2022 with the loss of 3,500 jobs.

No doubt some will say this is a small price to pay.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Feb 19 - 08:28 AM

Nice twist on Brexit
Seven right wing Labour politicians (4 with direct links to Israel) have left the Labour Party with a view to forming their own party
They give "antisemitism" and Brexit for their reason for doing so
One who isn't involved with Israel was one of the few successful in refusing to reveal the details of her expenses during the scandal
Good riddance to them - perhaps we can see a continuance of progressive Labour policies without being hampered by a yearning for a return to the good old days of 'New Labour's' "Weapons of Mass Destruction" and duck palaces for politicians pets
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 18 Feb 19 - 07:01 AM

In the search for good news, we should not overlook that the UK has struck a deal with the US to in effect roll over an existing EU agreement.

Ok, "keeping what we have" is perhaps stretching the definition of good news too far, but it doesn't immediately look like bad news ... assuming there have been no unpublished additional agreements of course.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 18 Feb 19 - 06:47 AM

Anyway back to Brexit.

I recall being told that nations across the world would be falling over themselves to have trade deals with the UK.

Now it seems that Japan are not too happy with our approach and this is on top of China cancelling trade talks last week.

Take into account Trumps America first approach and we don't seem to having nations beating a path to our door.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Feb 19 - 05:54 AM

I've always thought that any MP who stood and got elected on a party ticket, supported by party workers and party money, then left the party, should step down as an MP as well. They are there under false pretences. Anyway, good riddance. They have all worked to serially undermine Corbyn. Now they'll have to do it as pink Tories. And that'll get them nowhere.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 18 Feb 19 - 05:42 AM

For my part, I have no problem with any MP deciding they will vote according to their beliefs and judgement rather than the whip. In fact, the more, the better. And that applies to all parties.

I note that the breakaway people are calling themselves a group, not a party. That may just be a matter of where they are in the process but it may reflect that that there are enough differences between them they think a new party is a non-starter. They will of course be aware that our system is very unforgiving for new parties as well.


And isn't it an intriguing detail that 8 chairs were put out and seven MPs resigned? A miscount or a no-show I wonder?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 18 Feb 19 - 05:36 AM

Much like the huge divisions within the conservative party really.

Oh course they will be brushed under the carpet by our resident Brexiteers.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 18 Feb 19 - 05:30 AM

The labour luvvies will not like this!
You heard it from Guido!

Labour Split


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 07:49 PM

As we approach the horror of brexit, Kevin, denial has become the brexiteers' mantra. It's notable that, along with that, we are hearing less and less about the "opportunities" that brexit provides. Gone bit quiet, has that. But let's look on the bright side: we have a deal with the Swiss. At least we won't have to pay more for our cuckoo clocks. There's an upside to everything.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 07:20 PM

Essentially it’s the same fallacy you get when climate change deniers assert that, if there turned out to be natural factors that contribute to undesirable change, that means that any contribution to such changes from human activities can be of no importance, and that efforts to deal with them are misguided.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 06:25 PM

How the wren became king of the birds. I hate autocorrect! I only tolerate it because my typing on the phone would be even less decipherable without it...


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 06:23 PM

Also English is stuffed with sayings like "the straw that broke the camel's back" And "juggling too many balls" and stories like "how the arena became the king of the birds." Using the juggling metaphor, if it took juggling a specific four to run the business with difficulty, and adding a fifth called Brexit caused everything to be dropped it would be perfectly reasonable to blame the Brexit ball. True, you could have got rid of one of the others and juggled successfully, but you would have been losing one of the key four needed.

Blaming Brexit for a demise can be perfectly reasonable, even if it is comparatively small effect, should it be enough to tip the business over the edge.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 04:33 PM

Bugger! Missed! :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 04:32 PM

And I've got 700!


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 04:30 PM

700! Don't do it Ravgy!


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 04:26 PM

Well. lets see.

The nearest "city" to where I live in 40 miles.

Now in my youth I may have been able to walk that in 10/11 hours.

Now I fear it may take me a week.

Idiot.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 03:01 PM

Cars are not green. You should walk.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 02:49 PM

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47270616

Try again:-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 02:48 PM

Now I'n not about the buy a Porsche or a Audi, Lamborghini or a Bugatti.

However I could consider buying a Seat or a Skoda.

Now the German company is warning that prices may increase by 10% after the UK leaves the EU.

One should note that this is in addition to the rises created by the fall in the value of the pound since June 2016.

What price Brexit eh! I fear we're about to find out.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47270616


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 02:22 PM

The main difference being is that Brexit is perceived to be a factor.

A factor of our own making.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 01:22 PM

DMcG I do not really dispute your analysis. What somewhat irritates me is those that latch on to brexit as the sole cause of all things negative. Variable factors impact outcomes, from confidence to the weather. The problem arises in trying to assign the correct weighting to each of the variables besides actually being able to identify them in the first place.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 01:00 PM

This is the second time in about as many weeks I have pointed this out. Brexit can be A factor without being the ONLY or even the MAIN factor., That all low cost carriers are finding it tough does not affect whether Brexit uncertainty makes things tougher.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 12:31 PM

This winter is proving extremely cruel to small airlines, which have high fixed costs and, currently, very low revenues. It has precipitated the collapse of Primera Air, Cobalt of Cyprus and Germania before Flybmi.

Flybe, which is continuing operations as normal, has been rescued by a cash injection from a consortium involving Virgin Atlantic, Stobart Air and a US hedge fund – which bought it for just £2.2m.

Small regional airlines based in the UK are particularly vulnerable. Return journeys on domestic flights are subject to £26 in Air Passenger Duty, placing them at an immediate disadvantage. And whenever a route becomes successful, it is likely that a bigger player will elbow in with larger planes and lower fares.

Lets see a Scandinavian airline, a cypriot airline, and a german airline along with FlyBMI all kicked into touch and Flybe struggling.
All due to Brexit?
Pull the other one!

Awkward things facts.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 11:53 AM

The FlyMBI affair has now been linked to the Brexit fiasco on today's mid-day news, as if we didn't know already
Watch this space, this is just another of more to come
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 10:15 AM

I think their business model had been flawed for years. The only surprise is that they kept trading so long. The dog was dead, the infestation of fleas was insufficient to keep it moving. Brexit will occur after it's wake.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 08:11 AM

Potential purchasers of flyBMI and flybe will take the forecast return for whatever slots they own into account, and they will base any such forecast from today when Brexit is more than a gleam in anyone's eye.

It is silly to blame everything on Brexit. But it is equally silly to refuse to admit Brexit might be causing problems.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 06:48 AM

Everything that affects potential profitability feeds into that forecast, including how Brexit might alter the market.

No one can dispute that.
However the slots were sold off long before brexit was a gleam in anyone's eye. The residue of the company was a stripped out husk losing money from that time if my understanding is correct. From comments I have seen elsewhere it was a dead duck a long time back.
"The airline was heavily loss-making, and no-one was prepared to put in extra funding. The average passenger load per flight was just 18, meaning even the small regional jet planes flown by Flybmi were less than half-full, The typical Ryanair departure has 10 times as many passengers.

Since Flybmi split away from BMI, investors have pumped in £40m, which represents a subsidy of about £13 per passenger ever flown."


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 05:40 AM

It's a well-known fact in our house that a cracked-open bottle of prosecco must be consumed in full as one wouldn't want to be later consuming the flat article. We therefore never have 'a little prosecco" unless there are four or five of us, and even then it prompts the commissioning of a second bottle.

Back to the ruck...


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 05:15 AM

I did have a little prosecco on the grounds we had some still around from a party we had, so it was on hand when an family engagement was announced. But that's all, honest.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 04:54 AM

"Whoops everyone. Talk about brain not being engaged. That was a text to my daughter!"

ROTHLMAO! I was wondering what you were drinking last night...!! :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 04:40 AM

Whoops everyone. Talk about brain not being engaged. That was a text to my daughter!


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 04:39 AM

I am reminded of a brilliant "Rise and Fall or Reginald Perrin" where he invited all the senior staff of his company to a party and they all hung awkwardly aroubd his dining room whwre there was no food, but no one could mention it. After a long time he said, "Right every one, shall we move into the garden now?" Evwryone brightened up becauae obviously all the food was out there ... And it wasn't.

In the end he said there was no food but he had donated all the cost of it to a charity and was sure every one would agree. And of course they had no choice but to agree.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 17 Feb 19 - 04:27 AM

BMI Regional had emerged in 2012 as a spin-off airline, under new owners, after the mainline carrier BMI was sold to British Airways parent IAG. BMI Regional operated services under the brand name Flybmi

Flybe is a totally separate company that is also up for sale, Potential buyers have been mentioned as Easyjet and Stobart.

Brain not fully engaged. Apologies for confusion.


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