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BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?

DMcG 06 Oct 19 - 03:17 AM
Iains 05 Oct 19 - 09:01 AM
Jim Carroll 04 Oct 19 - 03:23 PM
Iains 04 Oct 19 - 02:29 PM
Iains 04 Oct 19 - 02:26 PM
DMcG 04 Oct 19 - 02:03 PM
Mossback 04 Oct 19 - 01:42 PM
Jim Carroll 04 Oct 19 - 01:38 PM
DMcG 04 Oct 19 - 01:26 PM
Jim Carroll 04 Oct 19 - 01:21 PM
Jim Carroll 04 Oct 19 - 09:42 AM
DMcG 04 Oct 19 - 09:15 AM
peteaberdeen 04 Oct 19 - 08:19 AM
Backwoodsman 04 Oct 19 - 06:59 AM
DMcG 04 Oct 19 - 06:52 AM
DMcG 04 Oct 19 - 06:44 AM
Nigel Parsons 04 Oct 19 - 05:58 AM
Nigel Parsons 04 Oct 19 - 05:55 AM
DMcG 04 Oct 19 - 04:57 AM
Jim Carroll 04 Oct 19 - 04:09 AM
Iains 04 Oct 19 - 04:07 AM
DMcG 03 Oct 19 - 05:04 PM
Steve Shaw 03 Oct 19 - 04:17 PM
The Sandman 03 Oct 19 - 03:53 PM
Jim Carroll 03 Oct 19 - 01:16 PM
Raggytash 03 Oct 19 - 12:57 PM
Jim Carroll 03 Oct 19 - 09:29 AM
Steve Shaw 03 Oct 19 - 09:26 AM
Steve Shaw 03 Oct 19 - 09:10 AM
DMcG 03 Oct 19 - 08:10 AM
Iains 02 Oct 19 - 04:01 AM
Jim Carroll 01 Oct 19 - 01:13 PM
Steve Shaw 01 Oct 19 - 10:55 AM
Iains 01 Oct 19 - 10:44 AM
Jim Carroll 01 Oct 19 - 08:50 AM
Backwoodsman 01 Oct 19 - 08:26 AM
Jim Carroll 01 Oct 19 - 07:03 AM
Backwoodsman 01 Oct 19 - 06:31 AM
Steve Shaw 01 Oct 19 - 05:37 AM
Iains 01 Oct 19 - 04:59 AM
DMcG 01 Oct 19 - 03:56 AM
Steve Shaw 30 Sep 19 - 08:12 PM
Steve Shaw 30 Sep 19 - 07:18 PM
Iains 30 Sep 19 - 07:12 PM
Mrrzy 30 Sep 19 - 06:47 PM
DMcG 30 Sep 19 - 06:29 PM
DMcG 30 Sep 19 - 06:23 PM
Raggytash 30 Sep 19 - 06:00 PM
DMcG 30 Sep 19 - 05:47 PM
Raggytash 30 Sep 19 - 05:31 PM
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 06 Oct 19 - 03:17 AM


Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn addressed a crowd of thousands of Labour supporters at Newcastle City Hall on Saturday night



No one should read too much into a single event, and these are largely party members, but this suggests claims that Corbyn has been rejected by the voters may be premature.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 05 Oct 19 - 09:01 AM

it's good to have the opportunity to remind people


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 03:23 PM

THIS WON BREXIT
THIS WAS THE IMMEDIATE RESULT
THIS WAS THE WARNING
THIS IS HOW IT IS STILL HAPPENING

That was to nobody in particular but it's good to have the opportunity to remind people - lest they forget
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 02:29 PM

That should of course been Rory Stewert, not Rod. It is very bad form to confuse a singer with a clown.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 02:26 PM

Brexit was decided by asking a people to b=vote on something without being given a game plan for the future or being kept up to date with the possible and now obvious consequences - that is how Populism works

The referendum was a binary decision. In or out.
It actually has absolutely nothing to do with populism. I explained this carefully earlier today but like so many of my posts it was deleted.
I am not going to waste my time explaining it again.

If Mps think they can can totally ignore their electorate, it is hardly surprising the electorate feel disregarded.
The originator of this novel concept, Burke, found that when he presented the good burghers of Bristol with this outrageous idea they promptly told him to get on his bike.

This will be brought home to a number of MPs with a vengeance when they finally have to succumb to a general election. They will find playing their electorate for fools has only one outcome. As Roddy Stewert would have found out. But he jumped before he was pushed.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 02:03 PM

Liz Truss, the international trade secretary, said scrapping the protections was "vital for giving us the freedom and flexibility to strike new trade deals and become more competitive"

I wonder who will be the first to insist that scrapping the protections is what 17.4 million demanded?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Mossback
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 01:42 PM

He who sups with the devil should have a long spoon ...


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 01:38 PM

I'm appalled having just escaped the worst of Huricane Lorenzo - Donegal wasn't so lucky)
This seems to be par for the course for dealing with Trump
Hope nobody mentions The Isle of Wight in his presence !
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 01:26 PM

Well, well, well, what a surprise!
"Brexit: Boris Johnson moves to scrap environment safeguards to get deal with Trump"


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 01:21 PM

Johnson found to be lying through his teeth again
A document from Downing Street states that if no deal is reached
Johnson will write to the EU and request an extension of the deadline, but he has just tweeted that there will be no delay and Britain will crash out if there is no deal
He appears to be trying to influence the outcome of the court case taking place over obeying The Benn Act - result will be announced early next week
Dominic Grieve has stated that if Johnson refuses to obey the Benn act the Queen will be left with no alternative but to sack him - he would "be gone within five minutes".
Aren't they using The Tower of London for criminals any more - bleedin' shame !!
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 09:42 AM

"If they were "dead in the water" then Varadker and the EU would have dismissed them out-of-hand."
No they wouldn't Nigel =- neither of them work like that because they can't afford to
The Good Friday Agreement hangs in the balance, which concerns Varadkar very much and Europe isn't the monolithic Bloc that ouy people dishonestly depict it - they can dismiss nothing out of hand without consulting the rest of the twenty off members
Only Britain is acting like a sulky teenager threatening to leave home unless they are given their way
Brexit was decided by asking a people to b=vote on something without being given a game plan for the future or being kept up to date with the possible and now obvious consequences - that is how Populism works
It is equivalent to sending a blindfolded man into a dark room to put a cross on a piece of paper, then holding him to the end result without him being allowed to reconsider
SFA democratic about that
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 09:15 AM

I can't see how the current 'No comment' from number 10 can last, given the apparent conflict between what Johnson told the party - and the public - and what he is promising the courts. Steve Baker's comments notwithstanding, the PM is not simply saying he will obey the law by seeking an extension, since the law requires him to ask and accept it in some cases, and in others to bring the length of extension back to the House. The PM might be hoping the EU suggests a different period which would allow him to get it back to the House where he has at least a chance of getting it rejected.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: peteaberdeen
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 08:19 AM

i'm just listening to radio scotland and hear that according to UK govt lawyers they will apply for an extension if there is no deal by halloween. sounds like a change of policy - but who knows what is going on. rory stewart going for london mayor. that's a shame for him - i'm sure he would be happier wandering around cumbria and the debatable lands. he must be more ambitious than he likes to appear. i wonder if he is hoping to be asked to lead a temporary government = presumably Johnson is about to resign rather than be 'dead in a ditch' before asking for an extension.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 06:59 AM

I’m in agreement with you, DMcG. I’ve always regarded Rory Stewart as ‘The Decent Face of Conservatism’. They could do with a few more like him.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 06:52 AM

I should add that my purpose in posting about Rory Stewart was less to pass on news than to express my regret, even though I disagree on many things, and to say that losing such people weakens Parliament, in my view. I don't think either the BBC or Sky publicised my regret :)


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 06:44 AM

I you insist on ex-Tory, fine. I meant it more in terms of values than formal membe4ship, as in his statement:
It’s always difficult to run against your own party. It’s been a painful journey for me. I suppose it was really crystallised when I had the Conservative whip removed.

I’ve been proud to be a member of the Conservative party. There are many values I share with it. I parted company largely over Brexit and the tone of the party


There is a significant proportion of the population that has Tory values and always votes Tory, but has never been a formal member. I think it fair to refer to them as Tory.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 05:58 AM

"It looks like Johnson's "new" proposals are dead in the water."
Both Varadkar and the EU executive have indicated that they are prepared to negotiate changes to the proposals


Surely not "dead in the water" if, as you say both Varadker & the EU executive are prepared to use them as a basis for negotiation. That is what Boris said when putting them forward.
If they were "dead in the water" then Varadker and the EU would have dismissed them out-of-hand.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 05:55 AM

Rory Stewart to stand down at next election
Yes, he's a Tory who is in favour of many things I disagree with.


Ex-Tory, surely.
Even the Guardian and The BBC make that clear when giving the same news.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 04:57 AM

Rory Stewart to stand down at next election

Yes, he's a Tory who is in favour of many things I disagree with. Nevertheless, I think this is a loss to 'the body politic'. We need thoughtful MPs, even if we disagree with them, not 'rubber stamps'.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 04:09 AM

I watched Question Time last night with a growing feeling of frustrated anger while the best of the speaker continue to miss the opportunity of pointing out that The Brexit Vote was as far from democratic as you can possibly get
The vote was won using Populisim - by appealing to people's basic fears and prejudices in the way Powell tried to when he was disgraced out of politics
That's what rejected, racist would-be politician did with his hate poster and that is what Johnson is doing now as a career move by an otherwise unelectable leader
It is extremely dangerous to attempt to equate this with democracy - it is exactly the opposite
THat is what needs to be emphasised
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 04 Oct 19 - 04:07 AM

How long are we going to have to put up with this ?

Howsabout until Samhain!

Interestingly Halloween takes its roots from the Samhain Eve, when it was believed that the link between the worlds of living and dead was at its strongest.

We valiant Brexiteers intend to ensure that bonds between the EU and Great Britain thenceforth are at their weakest.

apposite or wot??


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 03 Oct 19 - 05:04 PM

I am reading "Invisible Women" which has recently won the Royal Society science book prize. There are many interesting observations, but this one is very relevant to our discussion.. The 70,71,72,73 are references which I have not copied here, but have left as evidence these statements are not just pulled out of the air:

British politicians like to boast (particularly in the run-up to the EU referendum) that the UK offers a 'more generous' maternity leave than the fourteen weeks mandated by the EU’s 1992 Pregnant Workers Directive. 69 This is technically true, but it doesn’t mean that women in the UK get a good deal in comparison to their European counterparts. The average length of paid maternity leave across the EU is twenty-two weeks. 70 This figure hides substantial regional variation in both pay and length. Croatia offers thirty weeks at full pay, compared to the UK’s offering of thirty-nine weeks at an average of 30% pay. In fact a 2017 analysis placed the UK twenty-second out of twenty-four European countries on the length of 'decently paid maternity leave' it offered its female workforce (1.4 months). And now that Britain is leaving the EU, the country is likely to fall even further below its European neighbours. Since 2008, the EU has been trying to extend its maternity-leave ruling to twenty weeks on full pay. This proposal was stuck in stalemate for years, and finally abandoned in 2015 thanks in no small part to the UK and its business lobby, which campaigned strenuously against it. 72 Without the UK, the women of the EU will be free to benefit from this more progressive leave allowance. Meanwhile Martin Callanan (now a Brexit minister) made a speech to the European Parliament in 2012 in which he included the Pregnant Workers Directive in his list of the 'barriers to actually employing people' which 'we could scrap'. 73


Perez, Caroline Criado. Invisible Women (pp. 79-80). Random House. Kindle Edition.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Oct 19 - 04:17 PM

The trouble is, Dick, that all the opposition parties are far too intent on watching their arses and fretting about "how they'll be seen" than worrying about the best interests of the country. Jostling for political advantage, as they see it, is a sickness of our system, unfortunately. The LibDems are the worst of the lot. Swinson has made such vicious attacks on Corbyn in the last couple of weeks that she's burned all her bridges as far as retaining any chance of getting together to defeat Johnson is concerned. It's idiocy. At least the SNP have made overtures of a sort. It used to be the left factions that could never get their acts together. Oddly, the divisions in Labour have been kept pretty well under wraps for a little while. I wish that could spread to opposition parties in general.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: The Sandman
Date: 03 Oct 19 - 03:53 PM

we need a different government quickly, a National government but once again the liberals have messed this up


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Oct 19 - 01:16 PM

"It looks like Johnson's "new" proposals are dead in the water."
Both Varadkar and the EU executive have indicated that they are prepared to negotiate changes to the proposals
If the bulling mindless homophobic moron who claims to speak for the English people stands is anything to go by - they don't stand a chance
A perfect summing up of English historical arrogant racism
Just what broken Britain needs at present
How long are we going to have to put up with this ?
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 03 Oct 19 - 12:57 PM

It looks like Johnson's "new" proposals are dead in the water. The ERG, the EU and the opposition all seem to ridicule it.

So that's his own side, the legal opposition in the House of Parliament and the people he is supposed to be negotiating with.

It will be very interesting to see how he attempts to circumvent the law on the land in the next two weeks!


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Oct 19 - 09:29 AM

Johnson's entire border proposals are based on 'trust me, I'm a Prime Minister'
Corbyn describes it (accurately) as being "worse than May's")
It is doubtful that the Irish Government will accept it; hopefully the EU will kick it into touch
The now minority DUP have welcomed it - as they would
This is dangerously playing with Irish and British lives for a move that is already flushing the British economy down the pan
The seriously sick patients really are running the asylum
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Oct 19 - 09:26 AM

The European Parliament has said that Johnson's proposals are not even remotely acceptable and that it would veto any attempt to turn them into a deal. So that's that. Boris, you'll be writing that letter. But first, just watch how he spends the next two weeks engineering his way towards making the EU seeming to get all the blame. "Our Friends And Partners in Europe simply don't want to Get Brexit Done..."


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Oct 19 - 09:10 AM

Benn was on The World At One. He made it crystal clear that the EU has to accept any proposal before it can be put to any sort of meaningful vote in the Commons. I suppose that getting the House to show that it supports the deal might be seen by leavers to be putting pressure on the EU to accept. That won't work. The EU wants see Ireland fully protected and that there is a cast-iron guarantee that there can never be a border any more restrictive than the present one. The proposal fails on these accounts. Two weeks to go, Bozo, then the law of the land will tell you what to do.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 03 Oct 19 - 08:10 AM

Frank Fields has proposed a Parliamentary vote on the latest government proposals, so ai thought I would check whether Parliament voting in favour of his proposal would satisfy the Act started by Benn et al.

No, as I read it. The act says a withdrawal agreement needs to have been concluded with the EU. In law, concluded does not just mean ended, it requires success. So walking away would not count.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 02 Oct 19 - 04:01 AM

Good to see the political moderation still occurring on Mudcat. Presumably the lefties cannot take the truth about the constant absurdity of their arguments and must be protected.

Meanwhile they can insult with gay abandon.

This is not moderation it is partisanship by a moderator that has no clue about british politics.

What do you hope to achieve by such tactics?
You fool no one by allowing only a complete distortion of reality to be posted by remainiacs.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 01 Oct 19 - 01:13 PM

Boris says border checks are inevitable on the Irish Border - both sides
He has promised they will geep inconveniences down to a minimum
Good luck with that ***** one, say local businesses on both sides
I hope the E U says the same but on Boris's record of wining friends and influencing people, I very much doubt if even the DUP will support that self-harm
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 01 Oct 19 - 10:55 AM

Must've missed that, John - we have a fixer onside I presume!


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 01 Oct 19 - 10:44 AM

Meanwhile magic grandad is too busy rehearsing his new cover single to do anything useful.


Run, Run, Run, Run, Runaway


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 01 Oct 19 - 08:50 AM

Word is leaking out that Johnson's "new proposals" for Brexit of the Irish Border were put forward to Europe as an idea weeks ago and were so practical as to be forgotten about
They involve an Irish border where there has to be check on both sides, when you arrive and on the others side
They have already been dismissed by both the DUP and the Irish Government as unacceptable
It is suggested that Johnson will 'REVEAL ALL' tomorrow and, when he's satisfied all the Tory ladies, might talk about his Cunning Plan
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 01 Oct 19 - 08:26 AM

If someone, anyone, wishes to quote me, that’s fine, I’m perfectly happy to stand by my own words. However, I would request that any quote is of my words in their entirety - selective quotes present a distorted misrepresentation of what my words were intended to convey.

Here’s what I said, in its entirety....

”What a good thing it is, Steve, that there are courageous individuals in Parliament who understand their obligations as MPs - to act in the best interests of the entire nation, not just to bow to the wishes of a small minority of the population, even at the risk of their political careers and personal safety and well-being.

Time will show them to be the heroes of this disastrous, ridiculous Brexit idiocy.”
?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 01 Oct 19 - 07:03 AM

Duncan Carswell - First elected member of Parliament for
THESE SCUMBUCKETS
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 01 Oct 19 - 06:31 AM

What a good thing it is, Steve, that there are courageous individuals in Parliament who understand their obligations as MPs - to act in the best interests of the entire nation, not just to bow to the wishes of a small minority of the population, even at the risk of their political careers and personal safety and well-being.

Time will show them to be the heroes of this disastrous, ridiculous Brexit idiocy.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 01 Oct 19 - 05:37 AM

DMcG, I'd gleaned what you'd intended straight away!

The furore surrounding our charlatan prime minister rages unabated. I rarely listen to Woman's Hour, but the outrage among women over his trivialising of his issues with women clearly isn't going away. Nor should it. Nicky Morgan got it in the neck after her fawning and dismissive attitude on the matter on Newsnight last night (I must say that Emily Maitlis is getting better by the day). On a different tack, I see that Cummings is expecting "to spend the last two weeks of October in court."   Looks like The Party Of Laura Norder is beginning to think that it's one law for them and another for us...


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 01 Oct 19 - 04:59 AM

The sands of time are running out! A General Election is just over the horizon, where the electorate will have the chance to dethrone the rebels wholesale and have payback for their constant cheating, mendacity and absolute betrayal of their election manifestos.
There are several here that like to quote Burke. But seemingly they overlook the fact that when he spelt out his position(I go my own way-Bollocks to the Burghers) to the good Burghers of Bristol they lost no time in making his arse grass.
Never again was he elected to Parliament, he was selected to represent Rotten Boroughs.
    This little bit of history encapsulates a "lesson learnt", shortly to be harshly brought home to those MPs so full of hubris that they cannot see.
This will truly be a popcorn moment to savour and enjoy. Democracy will be restored and the people regain their sovereignty!
There seem to be some here argue that Parliament is sovereign.The antics of the treacherous bercow and the rebels patently illustrate the absurdity of such a definition. The only word that describes their most recent activities is a coup.
A coup d'état, also known as a putsch, a golpe de estado, or simply as a coup, means the overthrow of an existing government; typically, this refers to an illegal, unconstitutional seizure of power by a dictator, the military, or a political faction (the remainiacs)

concepts of sovereignty
by Kofi Annan
State sovereignty, in its most basic sense, is being redefined—not least by the forces of globalisation and international co-operation. States are now widely understood to be instruments at the service of their peoples, and not vice versa. At the same time individual sovereignty—by which I mean the fundamental freedom of each individual, enshrined in the charter of the UN and subsequent international treaties—has been enhanced by a renewed and spreading consciousness of individual rights. When we read the charter today, we are more than ever conscious that its aim is to protect individual human beings, not to protect those who abuse them.


Interesting discussion


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 01 Oct 19 - 03:56 AM

Johnson wants Brussels to rule out no deal in exchange for a promise from him to get a deal through Parliament.

Overhasty comment on my part there, sorry. What I meant was "Brussels to rule out *an extension* in exchange for a promise from him to get a deal through Parliament, and all my comments were based on what I intended to say, not what I did.

The Times article is now available online.


Even if Johnson brought back the existing Withdrawal Agreement and persuaded all ERGers to swallow their pride and vote for it even with the hated backstop, and added everything Labour had asked for to the political declaration, I do not see how he could swing it, because the declaration is not binding, so he could just drop such declarations whenever he wanted, and no one trusts him not to do that. Perhaps his only hope of getting a majority would be to make it subject to a binding referendum but that could not be held without an extension.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 30 Sep 19 - 08:12 PM

Looking into EU attitudes to this a bit more, it seems very unlikely that any member of the European Council would go so far as to carry out that veto. In fact, the Hungarian foreign minister has already said no. Orbán would have a lot to lose by alienating himself with the other leaders. It's a technical possibility only, and it's not what EU leaders do in any case, decisions generally being arrived at at that level by consensus. And if Johnson were seen to be doing that underhand kind of asking and getting told to shove off, he'd look like an even bigger law-evading dolt than he does now.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 30 Sep 19 - 07:18 PM

As I understand it, he's likely to try to get someone like Orbán to veto any request for an extension as his ploy to crash us out without a deal on 31 October. It would take just one nation to do that veto. I wonder how much the Commission can lean on its national leaders to do the right thing... One thing's for sure. There is nothing even remotely approaching a deal in the pipeline. The EU has already trashed his elaborate pie-in-the-sky nonsense about customs posts away from the border and "technological solutions." Bullshit reigns supreme.

This bloke is going to get away with lying repeatedly to the country, shitting on the legacy of Jo Cox, giving taxpayer bungs to his lover and putting his hand up women's skirts, because the leaver-ignorantes of this country think that these things don't matter, that he's just a characterful Jack-the-lad. If he's still in office in six months' time they'll soon see how much they do matter. Unfortunately, the rational among us won't feel inclined to indulge in schadenfreude.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 30 Sep 19 - 07:12 PM

I must congratulate the parliamentary rebels! They squeal to the courts to recall parliament and since they returned they have simply wasted time acting like escapees from a kindergarten. So much so that the Tories are ignoring them and continuing with their party conference.

The real icing on the cake is the halfwit, tin hat wearing McDonnell wasting even more parliamentary time, with the connivance of the fully rogue Bercow, in allowing him to indulge further in the comprehensively debunked conspiracy theory that the PM is being backed by “speculators who have bet billions on a hard Brexit” – a falsehood pushed by former chancellor Philip Hammond earlier this week.
So impressive is this allegation that Two of McDonnell’s former advisors have now debunked the conspiracy theory – namely James Mills and James Meadway.
I suspect my pet goldfish knows more about currency manipulation than
McDonnell. Someone in Parliament should answer McDonnell and tell him that if hedge funds really wanted to make a fortune shorting the country they would be promoting the Labour Party over Brexit because that would create sure and certain economic calamity. Especially with him in number eleven.

Maybe we will have other urgent questions put before Bercow on other conspiracy theories, including whether the moon is made of cheese, and whether DCMS are aware that Michael Jackson is in fact still alive, or has Elvis really been seen on the moon.........


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Mrrzy
Date: 30 Sep 19 - 06:47 PM

I gotta say, thanks, Brits, for trying to make us feel better. It is almost working. -Mrrica


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 30 Sep 19 - 06:29 PM

And as I forgot to day, if he can get a deal through Parliamnwt the extension would not be needed.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 30 Sep 19 - 06:23 PM

Bizarre comment on Newsnight that the front page of the Times says Johnson wants to ask Brussels to rule out no deal in exchange for a promise from him to get a deal through Parliament.


That makes no sense whatsoever.

1. No one feels inclined to take the PM at his word in the first place.

2. He would be promising something that is not in his remit: Parliament will decide whether a deal is acceptable and he has no majority to ensure they would.

3. No one has actually defined what this deal is.

4. ... and in particular whether it meets the EU requirements.


And one of the Tory panel - because it is at the conference - said he thought it a promising way forward.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 30 Sep 19 - 06:00 PM

Thank you.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 30 Sep 19 - 05:47 PM

Here is the link


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 30 Sep 19 - 05:31 PM

Curious article in the Guardian regarding food supplies in the UK and the probably/possible implications of a no-deal Brexit. The final paragraph is particularly telling.

Could someone please provide a link "What Britain Buys and Sells in a Day"


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