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BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire

Nick 09 Oct 17 - 03:29 PM
Raggytash 09 Oct 17 - 04:43 PM
Steve Shaw 09 Oct 17 - 05:02 PM
Nick 09 Oct 17 - 05:11 PM
Steve Shaw 09 Oct 17 - 05:19 PM
Gallus Moll 09 Oct 17 - 08:03 PM
Joe Offer 09 Oct 17 - 08:28 PM
punkfolkrocker 09 Oct 17 - 08:40 PM
Steve Shaw 09 Oct 17 - 08:54 PM
Joe Offer 09 Oct 17 - 10:20 PM
DaveRo 10 Oct 17 - 02:52 AM
Nick 10 Oct 17 - 10:53 AM
Steve Shaw 10 Oct 17 - 10:55 AM
Nick 10 Oct 17 - 10:56 AM
punkfolkrocker 10 Oct 17 - 11:00 AM
punkfolkrocker 10 Oct 17 - 11:00 AM
Gallus Moll 11 Oct 17 - 09:52 AM
Iains 11 Oct 17 - 01:01 PM
Raggytash 11 Oct 17 - 02:49 PM
Iains 11 Oct 17 - 04:17 PM
Steve Shaw 11 Oct 17 - 06:25 PM
Raggytash 12 Oct 17 - 03:20 AM
Iains 12 Oct 17 - 03:47 AM
Raggytash 12 Oct 17 - 03:59 AM
DaveRo 12 Oct 17 - 04:03 AM
Iains 12 Oct 17 - 07:50 AM
Steve Shaw 12 Oct 17 - 07:51 AM
Nick 12 Oct 17 - 08:12 AM
Nigel Parsons 12 Oct 17 - 08:19 AM
Steve Shaw 12 Oct 17 - 08:21 AM
Raggytash 12 Oct 17 - 08:39 AM
punkfolkrocker 12 Oct 17 - 08:57 AM
Raggytash 12 Oct 17 - 09:19 AM
Iains 12 Oct 17 - 10:26 AM
Tattie Bogle 12 Oct 17 - 11:09 AM
Steve Shaw 12 Oct 17 - 11:19 AM
JHW 12 Oct 17 - 02:42 PM
punkfolkrocker 12 Oct 17 - 03:02 PM
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Subject: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Nick
Date: 09 Oct 17 - 03:29 PM

I like autumn and winter. And one of the highlights - apart from homemade soup - is open fires. The weather is still mild but it was a bit chilly last week.

Is it too early to even be thinking about it? Do I need to wait for November?

In UK. Temperature still over 50F. Next Monday is coller - perhaps mid 40s - so perhaps an excuse then.

Looking for an excuse for guilty pleasure that I know is not really necessary...


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Raggytash
Date: 09 Oct 17 - 04:43 PM

An open fire .............. bliss............go on light it tonight, you can always open a window if it gets too warm, and if you have some peat to put on it so much the better.


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Oct 17 - 05:02 PM

We have two stoves, and one of them has been lit with just a small conflagration most nights for the last couple of weeks. Chimbley sweep coming on Thursday. Ton and a half of smokeless delivered last Friday, on special offer. Sawed up a load of logs two days ago. Get yer fire lit, Nick!


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Nick
Date: 09 Oct 17 - 05:11 PM

10 bags of coal delivered last week. I can hear it whispering from the coal shed some nights when the wind is from the north.


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Oct 17 - 05:19 PM

Getting all mine delivered at once saved me over fifty quid. I have got space to store it but not where the coal man can drive to. I therefore have big muscles at the moment, girls. as well as my Madeira tan (rapidly fading,so hurry). Now thatís what I call a special offer...


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Gallus Moll
Date: 09 Oct 17 - 08:03 PM

for Celts it is always time for a fire!
Whether indoors in the hearth or stove or an open air bonfire, summer or winter- the magic of the flames, the songs and stories, the sadness and laughter....alone or in a gathering, a blazing hot conflagration or even just a flickering candle flame - fire is an essential component of the singers of songs and tellers of tales, the makers of music.


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Joe Offer
Date: 09 Oct 17 - 08:28 PM

I used to think of wildfires as a summer occurrence here in Northern California, and I'd breathe a sigh of relief in September. But recently, the fire season has extended to October. The temperatures are lower, but the winds seem to be higher. There's one heck of a fire burning in the California Wine Country right now.
But it's almost to the point where we'll want to start heating our house. We heat with wood in a "fireplace insert" that burns wood safely and efficiently. We're allowed to use it any time of the year, but we won't be allowed to have open fires outside until maybe November. Our outdoor burning permits were suspended June 28.

-Joe, in wildfire country-


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 Oct 17 - 08:40 PM

I live in a densely inhabited town centre.
I don't know what the local laws are concerning smokey chimneys.
But every winter just one home a few streets away belches smoke every evening,
and pollutes the entire area.

Throughout winter, we still need slightly open windows to reduce condensation damp;
so the whole back of the house reeks of smoke...

I know which house it is, and it has a horse box parked outside.

We can just imagine their idealised little cosey countrified winter evenings at home,
completely oblivious to the discomfort they cause all other terraced homes for several streets down wind... ??

.. and yes I did grow up on a terraced estate in the 60s and 70s
where we all burned coal & coke fires and paraffin heaters ..
No middle class central heating [or fitted carpets and telephones]

But it's the 21st century now, and urban communities are more aware of good healthy environment....


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Oct 17 - 08:54 PM

They're probably doing illegal things. Ask at your town hall. Here in the middle of westcountry-nowhere no-one gives a damn. We burn mostly smokeless fuel, though we don't have to (Homefire Ovals is what we buy), topped up with a bit of wood that I've cut meself and dried for a few months. Burning wet or unseasoned wood, or cheap coal, is bad news not only for the environment but also for your chimbley.


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Joe Offer
Date: 09 Oct 17 - 10:20 PM

In many urban places in California, it is illegal to burn in a fireplace on certain days, usually when an an inversion layer traps smoke close to the ground. We're in a rural area and burn in a stove approved by the Environmental Protection Agency, so we're exempt. But we still get a lot of smoke in the area on certain days, and it can be hard to breathe.
Most of the time, the bothersome smoke is from wildfires and is uncontrollable; but occasionally on especially cold days in the winter, it's from fireplaces. Well-designed heating stoves help a lot.
-Joe-


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: DaveRo
Date: 10 Oct 17 - 02:52 AM

Smokeless zones seem to have become Smoke_control_areas


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Nick
Date: 10 Oct 17 - 10:53 AM

In light of the Global Warming thread, I have decided to abandon the thought of having a fir e and instead have started the rather tedious job of burying the 500kg of coal I have just purchased


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Oct 17 - 10:55 AM

Thatíll warm you up, Nick. Hadnít thought of it like that!


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Nick
Date: 10 Oct 17 - 10:56 AM

I considered setting fire to it all but...


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 10 Oct 17 - 11:00 AM

.. alternatively a new hobby to occupy the long winter days and nights cooped up indoors at home...

Coal carving handcrafted figurines, models, etc.... ??


[let's see if these pesky emojis have restarted posting properly again..]


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 10 Oct 17 - 11:00 AM

nope...


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Gallus Moll
Date: 11 Oct 17 - 09:52 AM

- It is essential to have a fire burning in the hearth on Hogmanay!
that, along with all the other tasks and preparations for the change of the year, is important.
And - when the 'Old new year' comes a couple of weeks later- that must be marked too.
Also the seasonal festivals of Imbolc, Beltane, Lunastal and Samhain!


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Iains
Date: 11 Oct 17 - 01:01 PM

Is it ever OK to light an open fire? It is a very inefficient way of burning fuel. Far better to burn in a stove. Less pollution and more heat directed to where it is required, rather than up the chimney.


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Raggytash
Date: 11 Oct 17 - 02:49 PM

And ZERO romance ....................

Sorry Iains, an open fire is a thing of beauty


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Iains
Date: 11 Oct 17 - 04:17 PM

Raggytash. I have no real axe to grind either way. I am more concerned that I can burn imported polish coal,yet can no longer cut my own peat.
The world is insane.


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Oct 17 - 06:25 PM

Well you can blame your hero Maggie for the fact that the coal you burn is Polish. Thereís plenty of good olí UK coal under your feet. As for peat, peat is not a renewable resource. Thereís more than enough peat for you and thousands of householders to cut turf for their personal domestic use. But that ainít how it is. I can go to a garage forecourt round here and buy large packs of commercially-exploited Irish peat in compressed briquettes very cheaply. But I donít live in Ireland, do I. I can go to the garden centre and buy huge sacks of peat-based compost, ruthlessly stripped from moorland and lowland deposits. And thatís nothing compared to the exploitation by the horticultural industry behind closed doors that we hardly see. Thing is, strip peat from moorland deposits where the climate is always wet and you expose the land to erosion and surface water flooding. Peat is a huge water-holding sponge that is hydrologically crucial. Thatís why you may be prevented from cutting it. Donít blame Poland. Blame the capitalist system which says exploit to the hilt today and sod tomorrow.


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Raggytash
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 03:20 AM

Iains, why can you not cut your own Peat? I love the aroma of peat smoke.

I don't have an open fire but occasionally light a piece of peat on the gas cooker just to have the smell of peat in the house. It's good for my soul ............... if I have such a thing.

Peat briquettes are crap, as nothing compared to the real thing.


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Iains
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 03:47 AM

This argument over the ever Blessed Maggie and the coalminers has been explained very carefully to you before shaw. Now pay attention. The UK mining industry had been in serious decline for decades before Maggie came on the scene. Scargill merely fast forwarded the inevitable. Polish coal is imported into Britain and Ireland because it is cost competitive. No other reason. As a man who constantly boasts about cheap wine deals, you should realise price wins, almost every time.
I see no need to blame the capitalist system, it is what it is. As yet no-one has found a fully functional substitute.
"As for peat, peat is not a renewable resource." By that facile statement are you trying to imply that coal is a renewable resource?
For a well educated scientist you have a lot to learn laddie.


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Raggytash
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 03:59 AM

I would have thought that Peat is a renewable source, it is growing every year but perhaps not at the rate we use it.


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: DaveRo
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 04:03 AM

In the long term, coal is a renewable resource.

But in the long term...


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Iains
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 07:50 AM

Raggytash. You are correct but the timeframe is over is over a fair few human generations for peat, and considerably longer for coal. For this conversation I think it safer to regard them as fossil fuels.
Interestingly there is a school of thought that upland bogs in Ireland were created by human interference, namely vegetation clearance, leading to soil erosion and subsequent acidification. Just a bunch of Neolithic vandals with no nanny state or greenpeace.


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 07:51 AM

Well, insulter-in-chief, you have a fair bit to learn about manners. Now as a matter of fact I made no comment about coal being a renewable resource or not, and you know that I know it isn't in any sense that we use the term, so enough of that rubbish if you don't mind. As for peat, for it to be regarded as a renewable resource you would have to remove it infinitesimally slowly. As I said, there's enough peat for private householders to cut turf for their own use and, responsibly done, it would have little impact on the environment. But that hasn't been what we've been doing with peat, is it? When we say that timber is a renewable resource, the caveat is that we either replace what we take and/or take it no more quickly than it grows back. We can't control the regrowth of peat (and anthropogenic climate change will actually slow its regrowth in many areas), so while it may be responsible to exploit it on a small, non-commercial scale we can't remotely regard it as a renewable resource.


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Nick
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 08:12 AM

Oh dear.

That's the last light hearted thread I start on Mudcat. I remember why I stopped using it


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 08:19 AM

31st October (Samhain/Hallowe'en)
5 November (Guy Fawkes)


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 08:21 AM

The point about those dismal packs of peat briquettes, which mostly comes from Ireland, is that, like peat-based composts, they represent the irresponsible exploitation of peat. Only when there's a sufficient outcry does anything get done about such things.


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Raggytash
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 08:39 AM

In Ireland, the people I know who do use Briquettes do so instead of going to cut their own turf. Swings and roundabouts in that case.


Still think Briquettes are a very poor substitute though.


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 08:57 AM

Seeing as you've reminded me of something long forgotten...

Back in Grammar School in the early 70s I'm sure our class was taken out for a day coach trip to see peat being cut....

But why...????? what educational / recreational purpose...???

As far as we were concerned it'd just have been a few hours off school and a chance to mess about...
and enjoying the novelty of packed sandwiches, crisps, and fizzy pop instead of school dinners...


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Raggytash
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 09:19 AM

There is something very therapeutic about watching peat being cut and stacked in the traditional way.

One down side these days is that once dried it is often collected in heavy duty plastic bags and left on the bogs to be collected as and when needed.


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Iains
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 10:26 AM

Raggytash. Ireland was found to be ignoring the EU Habitat Directives and had to enforce a ban on peat cutting within SAC areas. This mainly protected upland bog, the story on raised bogs I have no firsthand knowledge of. Traditional bog cutting is not regarded as very green, or environmentally friendly anymore. Yet Bord na Můna can still operate commercially continuing to destroy bog to produce briquettes and fire power stations. Best not to see what other EU countries had done to their bogs prior to the directives.


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Tattie Bogle
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 11:09 AM

Our area went "smoke controlled" about 20 years ago, so bye-bye to our open fire. Only period houses/listed buildings and more rural cottages were allowed to continue to burn wood and coal, unless you went to the big expense of putting in a wood-burner with catalytic converter.
We went for the cheaper option of a "coal effect" gas fire, which, in fact, we hardly ever use. Meantime our neighbour keeps chopping down allegedly dead hundreds-of-years-old trees, and we are regularly disturbed by the noise pollution of chainsaws working overtime.
We don't miss going out in all weathers to refill the coal bucket, stock up the logs, or empty the ashes and do all the extra dusting that comes with an open fire. Our kids and their friends missed lolling on the hearthrug right in front of the fire -until a spark hit them!
The big question for us is when to put the central heating back on; managed without it until a week or so ago. Not bad for Edinburgh!


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 11:19 AM

I took a sixth form field course in South Wales in 1979. Half way up the Blorenge I stopped the group to demonstrate the age and thickness of the blanket peat at one particular spot. I plunged my walking stick into the peat, declaring that the three feet it had descended to the base layer underneath represented 11,000 years of peat growth. When I withdrew the stick the ferrule had disappeared. You never know, one day a scientist studying the area may find a very puzzling ďfossilĒ...


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: JHW
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 02:42 PM

1970


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Subject: RE: BS: What date is it ok to light an open fire
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 03:02 PM

..reminds me, I've not lit a fart at a party since circa 1990...

[and that was through Marks 'n' Sparks cotton boxers and a tight pair of Levis - .. barely a singe... clothes were better made back then]

Wouldn't risk it now.. might not just be a fart....

oh.. and of course.. I'm now a proper mature grown up...


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Mudcat time: 19 October 4:07 PM EDT

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