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Music as torture?

Mrrzy 04 Dec 16 - 10:51 PM
leeneia 04 Dec 16 - 10:54 PM
meself 04 Dec 16 - 11:06 PM
Joe Offer 05 Dec 16 - 12:05 AM
GUEST,cnd 05 Dec 16 - 12:09 AM
michaelr 05 Dec 16 - 01:40 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Dec 16 - 03:01 AM
Dave Hanson 05 Dec 16 - 03:23 AM
GUEST,LynnH 05 Dec 16 - 03:34 AM
Will Fly 05 Dec 16 - 03:37 AM
GUEST,Pete Kiddle 05 Dec 16 - 03:42 AM
GUEST,Senoufou 05 Dec 16 - 04:24 AM
Thompson 05 Dec 16 - 04:42 AM
Mo the caller 05 Dec 16 - 04:54 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Dec 16 - 05:19 AM
Mr Red 05 Dec 16 - 05:33 AM
GUEST,Mark Bluemel 05 Dec 16 - 05:34 AM
Will Fly 05 Dec 16 - 05:34 AM
Stanron 05 Dec 16 - 05:41 AM
GUEST, DTM 05 Dec 16 - 05:51 AM
GUEST,Senoufou 05 Dec 16 - 05:55 AM
GUEST 05 Dec 16 - 06:08 AM
Senoufou 05 Dec 16 - 06:13 AM
Leadfingers 05 Dec 16 - 06:15 AM
banjoman 05 Dec 16 - 07:25 AM
Senoufou 05 Dec 16 - 07:37 AM
GUEST,DTM 05 Dec 16 - 07:38 AM
GUEST,Senoufou 05 Dec 16 - 08:08 AM
Stanron 05 Dec 16 - 08:17 AM
GUEST,Senoufou 05 Dec 16 - 08:23 AM
GUEST,keberoxu 05 Dec 16 - 09:34 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Dec 16 - 09:35 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Dec 16 - 09:37 AM
Steve Gardham 05 Dec 16 - 09:44 AM
GUEST,Senoufou 05 Dec 16 - 01:12 PM
GUEST,LynnH 05 Dec 16 - 01:52 PM
Steve Shaw 05 Dec 16 - 03:34 PM
GUEST,jim bainbridge 05 Dec 16 - 03:34 PM
GUEST,Senoufou 05 Dec 16 - 03:39 PM
Steve Shaw 05 Dec 16 - 04:05 PM
Stanron 05 Dec 16 - 04:11 PM
Senoufou 05 Dec 16 - 04:12 PM
Steve Shaw 05 Dec 16 - 04:15 PM
GUEST,theleveller 05 Dec 16 - 04:48 PM
Joe_F 05 Dec 16 - 09:33 PM
GUEST,Mark Bluemel 06 Dec 16 - 04:17 AM
Steve Shaw 06 Dec 16 - 04:46 AM
GUEST,Senoufou 06 Dec 16 - 05:47 AM
Steve Shaw 06 Dec 16 - 06:08 AM
Stanron 06 Dec 16 - 06:42 AM
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Subject: Music as torture?
From: Mrrzy
Date: 04 Dec 16 - 10:51 PM

Nickelback, really?

What song would you consider torture to have to listen to?


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: leeneia
Date: 04 Dec 16 - 10:54 PM

Anything loud, high-pitched, whiny and out of tune.

I was watching an educational film at the Cahokia Mounds, when the soundtrack played a loud, electronic simulation of a percussionist running a stick over a set of high-pitched chimes. (You know, those hanging silver tubes.) It actually made me scream out loud.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: meself
Date: 04 Dec 16 - 11:06 PM

I've never quite gotten the Nickelback thing - I mean, they're not my cup of tea, but I don't see how they're all that much worse than all those other bands who are not my cup of tea ....


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 12:05 AM

There's a YouTube playlist of 11 Popular Songs the CIA Used to Torture Prisoners in the War on Terror
  1. "The Real Slim Shady" by Eminem
  2. "Take Your Best Shot" by Dope
  3. "Dirrty" by Christina Aguilera
  4. "Zikrayati (My Memories)" by Mohamed el-Qasabgi
  5. "Babylon" by David Gray
  6. "I Love You" by The Barney Theme (an obvious choice, but they should have had something by Spongebob Squarepants, too. -JO-)
  7. "Saturday Night Fever" by the Bee Gees
  8. The Meow Mix theme (another obvious choice)
  9. "The Beautiful People" by Marilyn Manson
  10. "Fuck Your God" by Deicide
  11. "We Are the Champions" by Queen (makes basketball games and Trump rallies intolerable for many)


And here's one of those annoying slide shows with a list of 21 songs the CIA used for torture.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST,cnd
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 12:09 AM

Any harsh noise, industrial noise, or similar "genre" of "music." There's a reason the "genre" is called "noise"


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: michaelr
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 01:40 AM

I hear there are coffeehouses in the UK that play Fairport Convention to get the hipsters to move on.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 03:01 AM

They're thinking of playing loud Justin Bieber to scare away a plague of fruit bats in Australia. Who would be tortured more, the bats or the Aussies?


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 03:23 AM

opera, the Bee Gees, any boy band/girl band, pre-pubescent kids, oh FFS don't get me started.

Dave H


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST,LynnH
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 03:34 AM

"Last Christmas............" AAAAArrrrgggggghhhhhh!!!!!!!!


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Will Fly
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 03:37 AM

You call all that torture? I'll tell you what musical torture is - I suffered under it at a singaround on Monday evening last week.

It was a lady with a high, dismal, toneless voice singing an interminable ballad that she hadn't bothered to learn, had "written it down yesterday for the first time", from sheet after sheet of paper. It was utterly, incredibly boring and seemingly endless. When the third sheet had been turned over, I lost the will to live and fell into a coma from which I could only be awoken by liberal helpings of Dark Star Winter Ale.

Now that's torture.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST,Pete Kiddle
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 03:42 AM

Folk club renditions of 'The Wild Mountain Thyme' ?


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST,Senoufou
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 04:24 AM

Actually I'm surprised this is all so lighthearted. These prisoners were apparently chained with their hands between their legs, unable to take of the earphones, and loud songs played repeatedly foe 30 hours at a time. For several months. I don't personally find this amusing...


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Thompson
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 04:42 AM

I can never understand why torture is used when kindness is so much more effective.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Mo the caller
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 04:54 AM

Senoufou is right, of course. Unbelievable that anyone would do that in the name of 'western values'.

But language always changes and exaggerates.

The song that I find painful is 'Have yourself a Merry Little Christmas'. Insulting to those who believe in the 'true meaning of Christmas' (I was one of those long enough to see that viewpoint), and to those whose troubles don't go away so easily.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 05:19 AM

Yeah, why "little" Christmas! But for a bad Christmas song that awful McCartney one would take some beating. And Classic FM playing carols for four solid weeks before Christmas is sheer torture.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Mr Red
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 05:33 AM

Opera you say, how are you on Florence Foster-Jenkins?

Call me undemanding but I have yet to be tortured. When I worked with some people who had pop music blaring I had work as a distraction.
Otherwise I can choose to depart in most instances. Family is different, they have to endure my preferences at times too!

If irritation is the price I pay to get time out for the the chance to dance with a wonderful dancer to an Andy Cutting waltz, I pay, willingly.

(other Andy Cutting waltzes are available. Pure gold)


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST,Mark Bluemel
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 05:34 AM

michaelr said: "I hear there are coffeehouses in the UK that play Fairport Convention to get the hipsters to move on."

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/society/cafe-puts-on-fairport-convention-to-drive-out-hipsters-20161201118237

The Daily Mash is a parody site...

However Richard Thompson reposted this on Facebook saying he was proud to be associated with it :-)


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Will Fly
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 05:34 AM

Eliza, the original posts to the thread were reasonably light-hearted, It was Joe's post which brought in the political torture element which, of course, is all too true.

My own post was in the spirit of the original.

As far as torture as persuasion (as opposed to punishment) is concerned, I'm always reminded of the competition between the sun and the wind to see which one could get a traveller to remove his coat. The wind huffed and puffed, but the traveller just wound his coat more tightly round himself. The sub beamed and poured sunshine on the traveller - who removed his coat to cool off.

I always thought that was a nice parable.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Stanron
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 05:41 AM

Music as torture? Try listening to Radio 1 if you are older than 15. All right then 45.

The only thing worse would be the same thing with adverts.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST, DTM
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 05:51 AM

Having a short interest span, I can only listen to a few songs in a row of certain genres. These include Blues, Trad Jazz, Bothy Ballads, Heavy Rock, Classical, Rap, Disco, House,Hawiian Music, Indian Music, Instrumentals, and so on.
I really need to find a secluded cave.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST,Senoufou
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 05:55 AM

I like most types of music, including Eminem. But it's the 'played very loudly' and 'repeatedly' which would be tiresome. I don't like loud noises of any kind. And even my favourite tunes and songs would be detested after the twentieth time of hearing.

It's very true that to change people's mindset and show them that their evil actions are execrable, the best way is kindness, gentleness and love. Maybe even those things won't succeed, but it's absolutely certain that cruelty and torture will merely increase hatred and provoke vengeance and counter-attack. Torture is no better than terrorism.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 06:08 AM

I seem to remember a movie in which somebody was tortured by having "Itsy Bitsy Teeny Weeny Yellow Polka Dot Bikini" player at them, sped up, at volume. It was funny because it wasn't real - then.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Senoufou
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 06:13 AM

It was 'One Two Three' (directed by Billy Wilder)


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Leadfingers
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 06:15 AM

I've suffered for my art - Now its your turn !


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: banjoman
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 07:25 AM

Melodeons are the worst form of torture by far, especially when someone who attempts to play one tells me that my banjo is not a traditional instrument while his screeching vile monstrosity is.
In the right hands (dustbin men) they may be acceptable but not to me


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Senoufou
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 07:37 AM

I think that those ghastly recorders children 'play' (we use the term loosely) would drive me round the bend in a nanosecond. We used to have them at school ('Twinkle Twinkle Little Star'), and I cringe now to think of the pain and suffering we caused!


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST,DTM
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 07:38 AM

Anybody learning how to play a recorder or violin can inflict the cruelest torture on a musical ear.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST,Senoufou
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 08:08 AM

Oh yes, GUEST DTM, whenever I hear children attempting to play the violin, I'm reminded for some reason of all the cats whose gut was used to make the strings. It sounds as if they're all miaowing and caterwauling at once in revenge!


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Stanron
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 08:17 AM

Isn't cat gut an urban myth?. Gut strings came from sheep. I heard it on QI, but then again QI expounds a theory of of declining truth. That is any commonly held truth is likely to be proved untrue with the passing of time. The longer the time the greater the likelihood.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST,Senoufou
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 08:23 AM

You're absolutely right Stanron (I've just Googled it). I know it isn't nice for the sheep either, but I'm quite glad no cats were used!


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST,keberoxu
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 09:34 AM

My music history professor at university, a spirited stand-up-comic-manqué, used to describe scholarly, painstakingly prepared performances of music of a certain vintage, with this irony:

"This is dead music, and we will now show you how it died."


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 09:35 AM

Bodhran


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 09:37 AM

Sorry, thread drift. I forgot that "music" was in the title.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 09:44 AM

Sorry! None of the above. How tolerant am I?


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST,Senoufou
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 01:12 PM

The point about the prisoners in Guantanamo Bay is that they hadn't had any form of trial. They were technically only 'suspects'. It's wrong in my view to detain anyone at all for years without trial. To then proceed with torturing them is appalling.

Just because one Muslim is a rapist and a murderer doesn't justify imprisoning and torturing any Muslims one happens to 'suspect'.

There isn't any justification for torture. None.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST,LynnH
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 01:52 PM

....and then there are these anaemic, gutless renditions of Hallelujah as a dreadful dirge..............

And another thing:

"Sadly not just one Senoufou think back to Cologne New Years eve night, swarms of them, swarms of these bastards and seeing nothing wrong in their eyes at emptying their bag in innocent young white Christians."

There are plenty young white 'christian' males around with the same attitude!


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 03:34 PM

In that case I apologise for my bodhran remark. It was a hysterical hate comment. 😂


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST,jim bainbridge
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 03:34 PM

without any disrespect to the late Leonard Cohen, his music was torture to me-

I used to play in a bar in West Cork and when, even after a very liberal closing time was passed & the music had stopped, a resolute few remained, the owner would use full wattage on his sound system to direct a bit of Vivaldi at them0 it always worked...


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST,Senoufou
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 03:39 PM

So I should think Steve, it was flagrant bodhranism. Bodhrans have their feelings you know.

By the way, how DOES one pronounce 'bodhran'?


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 04:05 PM

I don't say dirty words so I don't know.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Stanron
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 04:11 PM

GUEST,Senoufou wrote: By the way, how DOES one pronounce 'bodhran'?
Isn't it "Bore on"?


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Senoufou
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 04:12 PM

:)
I think it's bow-ran.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 04:15 PM

It's pronounced "sessionwrecker." I've just looked it up.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST,theleveller
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 04:48 PM

Ten minutes listening to shanty "singing" and I'd confess to anything. Five minutes of Frank Sinatra has the same effect.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Joe_F
Date: 05 Dec 16 - 09:33 PM

During the Waco siege (1993), according to Wikipedia,
"Increasingly aggressive techniques were used to try to force the Branch Davidians out (for instance, sleep deprivation of the inhabitants by means of all-night broadcasts of recordings of jet planes, pop music, chanting, and the screams of rabbits being slaughtered)." That seems to me to put pop music in its proper company. I wonder if the FBI paid the usual royalties for a public performance.


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST,Mark Bluemel
Date: 06 Dec 16 - 04:17 AM

GUEST,Senoufou wrote: By the way, how DOES one pronounce 'bodhran'?

With distaste...


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Dec 16 - 04:46 AM

Ah, this is like the good old days, any music thread eventually and inevitably turning to bodhran-bashing. I love it!


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: GUEST,Senoufou
Date: 06 Dec 16 - 05:47 AM

But...but... forgive me, but what exactly IS the objection to a bodhran? I mean, it's just a percussion instrument not a piece of wet poo.
It just goes bang bang bang doesn't it? There aren't any politically incorrect connotations or inappropriate associations (as in the case of a wobble board for example)
Please explain yourselves! (stern retired-teacher voice)


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Dec 16 - 06:08 AM

I would much rather the bodhran owner brought in a lump of wet poo to bash than a bodhran. Smellier, maybe, but a damn sight quieter!


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Subject: RE: Music as torture?
From: Stanron
Date: 06 Dec 16 - 06:42 AM

GUEST,Senoufou wrote: but what exactly IS the objection to a bodhran?
People who play tunes in tunes sessions first have to learn to play their instrument. (not enough?)

Then they have to learn a lot of tunes. (still not enough?)

Then they have to learn to play these tunes at the pace they get played by the people who have been playing them several nights a week for the last five or ten or more years.

By the time they can do this they will have become aware of what might be called generic 'dialects' of playing.

Some-one who has just bought a 'Bore on' goes to a session for the first time and tries to join in.

Who has the good time and who has the bad time?

There are good bodhoran players and playing with them is a pleasure. They will have gone through a similar process to other players over similar periods of time. It's the first day thumpers who give the rest a bad name.


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