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BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon

Songwronger 19 Apr 13 - 07:39 PM
Don Firth 19 Apr 13 - 07:32 PM
Ron Davies 19 Apr 13 - 06:29 PM
Ron Davies 19 Apr 13 - 06:24 PM
Greg F. 19 Apr 13 - 06:21 PM
Ron Davies 19 Apr 13 - 05:38 PM
Jack the Sailor 19 Apr 13 - 05:08 PM
McGrath of Harlow 19 Apr 13 - 05:04 PM
Don Firth 19 Apr 13 - 04:45 PM
Ron Davies 19 Apr 13 - 04:34 PM
Bill D 19 Apr 13 - 03:41 PM
Ron Davies 19 Apr 13 - 02:58 PM
Don Firth 19 Apr 13 - 12:25 PM
Ron Davies 19 Apr 13 - 12:08 PM
Ron Davies 19 Apr 13 - 12:06 PM
pdq 19 Apr 13 - 11:24 AM
Greg F. 19 Apr 13 - 11:18 AM
Ron Davies 19 Apr 13 - 11:12 AM
Greg F. 19 Apr 13 - 11:09 AM
Stu 19 Apr 13 - 10:27 AM
pdq 19 Apr 13 - 10:26 AM
Bettynh 19 Apr 13 - 09:54 AM
Rapparee 19 Apr 13 - 09:50 AM
bobad 19 Apr 13 - 09:49 AM
bobad 19 Apr 13 - 09:08 AM
bobad 19 Apr 13 - 07:34 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Apr 13 - 07:32 AM
GUEST,Lavengro 19 Apr 13 - 07:28 AM
Jim Martin 19 Apr 13 - 06:47 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Apr 13 - 05:01 AM
Ebbie 19 Apr 13 - 03:22 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Apr 13 - 02:48 AM
pdq 18 Apr 13 - 06:04 PM
Jack the Sailor 18 Apr 13 - 05:41 PM
bobad 18 Apr 13 - 05:31 PM
Don Firth 18 Apr 13 - 04:05 PM
Wesley S 18 Apr 13 - 02:59 PM
Rapparee 18 Apr 13 - 09:41 AM
beardedbruce 18 Apr 13 - 07:59 AM
Don Firth 18 Apr 13 - 01:48 AM
Don Firth 18 Apr 13 - 01:13 AM
Jack the Sailor 18 Apr 13 - 01:13 AM
Songwronger 17 Apr 13 - 08:05 PM
kendall 17 Apr 13 - 07:45 PM
Songwronger 17 Apr 13 - 07:12 PM
McGrath of Harlow 17 Apr 13 - 02:56 PM
Wesley S 17 Apr 13 - 02:38 PM
jacqui.c 17 Apr 13 - 12:43 PM
jacqui.c 17 Apr 13 - 11:04 AM
Rapparee 17 Apr 13 - 09:36 AM
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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Songwronger
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 07:39 PM

It's a shit sandwich the media is feeding you, in case you're wondering what that familiar taste is. The Russian dressing a new touch, but it's the same ol shit.

Let's have our moment of hate now. Bad Russians. Bad Russians.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Don Firth
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 07:32 PM

Ron, people such as Guest from Sanity, ichMael, Songwronger, and a couple of others are heavily into blaming Obama for everything from childhood measles to meteors from space, and are doing back-flips trying to connect the Boston Marathon bombings with an "Obama plot." They attack others who don't buy their bigotry and their asinine conspiracy theories by attacking them as "loony Liberals," and claiming that Liberals are all "brainwashed by the media," when THEY, themselves, are the ones who are parroting Rush Limbaugh Bill O'Reilly, and other Right Wing commentators and blow-hards.

In religious argument, you are generally right in that many liberals tend to be anti-religious and are most likely to buy the writings of Dawkins, et al, but there are some very liberal churches, both religiously and politically.   Religious fundamentalists are almost exclusively Right Wing.

You can't really lump the two together.

And I don't know of a single real Liberal who spews the "Obama is a Social/Fascist/Muslim/Kenyan neocolonialist" line. In fact, just the opposite! True, they may be disappointed in him for not showing enough backbone against Congress's stonewalling and are often on his case about that. But the "birthers" and that bunch of conspiracy theorists are consistenly Rightists.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Ron Davies
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 06:29 PM

Notice I didn't say: Two words:   Wrong again.

Since I wouldn't want to be incendiary.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Ron Davies
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 06:24 PM

Thank you, Mr. Exhibit A.    Anybody who reads your posts need read no further.

Yet again, QED

But by the way, congratulations on staying out of the gutter recently.   Do you think you can stay out?

We're pulling for you.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Greg F.
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 06:21 PM

So what are they, Oh Simple Seeker After Truth, Fount Of All Knowledge and Supreme Intellectual Giant: solutions, examples, explanations, or hobby-horses?

Or are you just having trouble making up that gigantic steel-trap mind of yours?


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Ron Davies
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 05:38 PM

"It's religion's fault."    Again, c'mon.    This is not the same as "lack of religion's fault" which you may find as a culprit, but not much on Mudcat.


Don, look at my list.   Every one, as I said, is the hobbyhorse of a leftist on Mudcat.

On Mudcat, I don't think there are many Rightists who blame Obama for everything.   What you mainly find is those who blame Obama for not being Left enough.

Or people who blame Obama since they're desperate for a scapegoat and he's the handiest.   This last category would be people who refuse to think at all beyond bumper-sticker level.

But I don't think they qualify as Rightists.   Off Mudcat, sure there are lots who do. But not here.

Again, I am not talking about the wider world, just the intellectual giants on Mudcat.
For instance please quote a Mudcatter who has seriously talked about Obama as being a Kenyan socialist.    We have however had a stellar attorney who referred to him as a coconut--not black enough in the writer's considered opinion--from the vast experience of the writer, a white man in the UK, of being an American black man.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 05:08 PM

From: Ron Davies - PM
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 12:06 PM

QED

Our brilliant commentators on the Left seem to be addicted to bumper-sticker explanations of problems.

It's the Right's Fault (or GOP's Fault)
or
Is Obama a Social/Fascist/Muslim/Kenyan neocolonialist

It's Israel's Fault
or
What can't Palestine stop hitting its self?

It's Religion's Fault
(You got me on this one No one is blaming the lack of religion on this forum. But people I know blamed Newtown on the lack of school prayer.)

It's Capitalism's Fault.
or
Is Obama a Social/Fascist/Muslim/Kenyan neocolonialist

It's the US' Fault
or
Is Obama a Social/Fascist/Muslim/Kenyan neocolonialist


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 05:04 PM

For once when they announced that the suspects were "Caucasian", using that curious American terminology, they actually appear to have been correct...


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Don Firth
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 04:45 PM

Sorry, Ron, but you seem to have got the wrong end of the stick. Those around here who seem to be the ones to leap to conclusions are Rightists, who tend to be Fox News junkies and fans of Rush Limbaugh and Ayn Rand. The "Blame Obama for everything!!" crowd.

Are you in Great Britain? I think what the British call "leftists" is not quite the same as here in the U. S.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Ron Davies
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 04:34 PM

Yes, Leftists.    Maybe the wacko Rightists are elsewhere.

Consider the list of bumper-sticker solutions--and examples-- I've given.

Every one of them is the darling of one or more leftists on Mudcat.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Bill D
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 03:41 PM

hmmm? Leftists? I'm mostly staying out of this thread because of side taking and hurried decisions. I saw way too many MEDIA hurried reports that ended up being false....


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Ron Davies
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 02:58 PM

"Russian crazies".    C'mon people, don't you read or listen to anything?   It seems clear they were of Chechen heritage--a group struggling against Russian domination of their area.

What's more, they weren't even born in Chechnya.

It's unclear what the motive was, but so far there is nothing to link the attack to anything having to do with the Chechen conflict.

Why do so many Catters insist on snap judgments of everything? Are they (especially Leftists, it seems) so much prisoners of technology that they demand that every question be answered in 1 1/2 minutes, since that's the limit of their attention span?


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Don Firth
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 12:25 PM

News report this morning included an interview with a woman who knew the family, and the two brothers. She said that they were nominally Muslim, but they never went to the mosque and didn't seem to be in the least bit interesting in religion. Nor, she said, did they seem to be interested in any particular cause.

Making rash assumptions and leaping to conclusions only leads to confusion, mistakes, and possibly, disaster.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Ron Davies
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 12:08 PM

Oh yeah, don't forget the classic theory that the US put the maid up to entrap the Socialist French bigwig.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Ron Davies
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 12:06 PM

QED

Our brilliant commentators on the Left seem to be addicted to bumper-sticker explanations of problems.

It's the Right's Fault (or GOP's Fault)

It's Israel's Fault

It's Religion's Fault

It's Capitalism's Fault.

It's the US' Fault

Anybody who wants examples, hey, no problem.    This thread has wonderful exhibits--as do a huge number of threads on religion, Israel, the death of Chavez (it's supposed to be only reasonable to leave open the possibility that the US killed him), the 11 September bombings,   etc. etc, ad nauseam.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: pdq
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 11:24 AM

There goes the neighborhood.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Greg F.
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 11:18 AM

From the Mother Jones Article:

Update: This post has been updated to clarify that the YouTube user's identity is not confirmed.

and

...fundamentalist Australian Muslim preacher who rails against the evils of Harry Potter.

Just like the fundagelical "Christian"[sic] millenialist Bring-on-the -End-Times-and-Armageddon-&-the-Race-Wars preachers have railed against Harry Potter and other percieved agents of devil worhip for years.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Ron Davies
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 11:12 AM

"Olympic champions in Leaping to Conclusions..."

Some people wait til more facts are available and some pontificate based on their own prejudices.

QED

The latter, for some reason, on Mudcat at any rate, tend to be quite left of center.    It would be interesting to discuss why. I know there are wackos on the Right, but our people right of center often make more sense than those on the Left--(except on gun control).


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Greg F.
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 11:09 AM

PeeDee doesn't need any evidence. Nor does he care that instructions for making that type of bomb are available all over the internet.

Just the usual anti-Muslim bullshit from the ususl anti-Muslim bullshitters.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Stu
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 10:27 AM

"The bombs were pure al-Qaeda so it does not really matter where the perps were born."

Evidence?


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: pdq
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 10:26 AM

"Russian crazies, who would have guessed?


The bombs were pure al-Qaeda so it does not really matter where the perps were born.

What matters is who they were listening to.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Bettynh
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 09:54 AM

Russian crazies, who would have guessed? Right now I'm feeling that Fareinheit 451 was prophetic after all. All that was missing was the overhead view of the final shootout - and that's coming soon with private drones.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Rapparee
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 09:50 AM

The AP reports one of the brothers as dead and the other as having escaped. A Metropolitan Boston Transit Authority (MBTA) police officer was wounded and in serious condition. The dead man died of blast injuries and gunshot wounds. Apparently they hijacked a car, let the driver off unharmed at a gas station, and were chased by police. Gunshots and explosive devices were directed at the pursuing cops and the final act came after the car was stopped.

Boston is pretty much a ghost town right now, with everything closed and shuttered, transit not running, etc.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: bobad
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 09:49 AM

A true hero:

"Wounded Man in Iconic Marathon Photo Helped Identify Alleged Bombers
Maggie Lange        

Before the blast took both his legs below the knee, Jeff Bauman says that he looked into the eyes of one of the alleged bombers. According to Jeff's brother Chris:

    "He woke up under so much drugs, asked for a paper and pen and wrote, 'bag, saw the guy, looked right at me.'"

Bauman's testimony, provided just moments after he revived in the hospital, has likely helped the FBI narrow the bombing suspects.

In one of the most graphic and wrenching images of the marathon bombing injuries, Bauman is the man in the wheelchair pushed by first responders moments after the explosions. Bauman was waiting for his girlfriend to cross the finish line of the marathon just before 3 p. m. According to Chris Bauman, Jeff saw a man in a cap, a black jacket over a hooded sweatshirt, eyes behind sunglasses look at him, and drop a bag at his feet.

Two and a half minutes later, the bag detonated. First responders rushed the severely wounded Bauman to the Boston Medical Center. While still in intensive care, he gave descriptions to the FBI and helped them isolate the suspects from hours of video of the attack.

Bauman's report of a face-to-face confrontation may have been one the key clues that helped the investigations team identify the current suspects—Dzhokar A. Tsarnaev, 19, of Cambridge and his now deceased 26-year-old brother, Tamerlan. The hunt for these two alleged bombers resulted in a violent shoot-out and a temporary lockdown for the city of Boston. Dzhokar A. Tsarnaev is still at large."


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: bobad
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 09:08 AM

"The deceased suspect in the bombing of the Boston marathon, which killed three and injured more than 170, appears to have posted a video extolling an extremist religious prophecy associated with Al Qaeda to his YouTube page."

Mother Jones


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: bobad
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 07:34 AM

AP sources identify the surviving Boston bomber as Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, 19. The man is said to be from Russia's south, not far from the Chechen Republic.

The man reportedly lived in Turkey before arriving legally in the US about a year ago.

The name is listed among the recipients of Cambridge scholarships in 2011.

The second suspect is said to be his brother.

An NBC report claims the two immigrated at least two years ago. One of the brothers is said to have a Massachusetts drivers' license.

There is a page at the Russian social network VKontakte (In Contact) with the name Dzhokhar Tsarnaev living in Boston and studying at Cambridge Rindge & Latin School.

The page mentions a school in Makhachkala, the capital of the Republic of Dagestan, as a place Tsarnaev studied between 1999 and 2001.

The Tsarnaev family moved to Dagestan from Kyrgyzstan in 2001, the school spokesman told RT. He Dzhokhar studied there for just one year and produced no particular impression, good or bad, on the teachers.

Dzhokhar has several Chechen-related interests stated in his profile. He states that he speaks Russian, English and Chechen and holds career and money as his personal priorities.

The page has but a handful of posts, most of them jokes. The owner's last visit of the page was from a mobile phone shortly before the shooting in Boston started.

Some Russian-language comments on the page accuse Tsarnaev of being behind the bombing. They were posted after the news of a possible connection of a Dzhokhar Tsarnaev to the bombing broke.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 07:32 AM

Brothers from Chechnya.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: GUEST,Lavengro
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 07:28 AM

Obviously the remaining killer and whatever support network he has need to be brought into custody as soon as possible. Equally obviously doing that without further loss of life is the ideal to strive for. However, does anyone else think shutting down the entire transportation network and asking people not to leave their homes or go to work is an over reaction?

It seems to me that it is an additional victory to bring one of the USA's most iconic cities and tourist hotspots to a standstill for....... how long?

Let's hope this resolves as soon as is humanly possible for all concerned.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Jim Martin
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 06:47 AM

Almost total lockdown in Boston!


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 05:01 AM

Black cap dead, whit cap on run.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Ebbie
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 03:22 AM

Of course, it is not sure yet that the two men they are pursuing are the ones who committed this deed- but it appears quite likely.

The part that I'm agog over is the speed with which things are progressing.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 02:48 AM

Massive police operation in Boston area by: Staff writer
From: news.com.au
April 19, 2013 4:40PM
Police officer shot dead at Boston university, MIT
Suspects involved in carjacking, grenades thrown
Major operation underway after police car chase


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: pdq
Date: 18 Apr 13 - 06:04 PM

Here is one of the best pictures I can find...

                                                                                                               both suspects


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 18 Apr 13 - 05:41 PM

Photo here: Salon said the FBI site has crashed.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: bobad
Date: 18 Apr 13 - 05:31 PM

Photos and videos of suspects released: FBI


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Don Firth
Date: 18 Apr 13 - 04:05 PM

Obama couldn't possibly have been involved in the Boston Marathon explosions.

He was in Texas, setting charges at the fertilizer plant.

I just thought the Tinfoil Hat Brigade would like to know.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Wesley S
Date: 18 Apr 13 - 02:59 PM

"Navy Seals at the marathon, with black backpacks, etc."

"Then the military moved in and made it happen."

Tell you what Songwronger - Get off the computer - grow a pair - and walk up to a Navy Seal and tell him you think some of his brothers planted those bombs and then let me know what his response was.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Rapparee
Date: 18 Apr 13 - 09:41 AM

I thought of that when it happened. That doesn't make it so. It could also have been someone who doesn't think that people should have their legs bare in public. Or just a plain old-fashioned nut case.

We don't know yet.

Yes, the DPRK has quite a history of terror attacks and not always in their own backyard.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: beardedbruce
Date: 18 Apr 13 - 07:59 AM

Good point, Don.


We don't know until we know.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Don Firth
Date: 18 Apr 13 - 01:48 AM

F. Michael Maloof, formerly with the Pentagon's Technology Security Operations, writes:
WASHINGTON – The Boston Marathon bombing that killed three people and wounded more than 180 was on the same day as the 101st anniversary of the birthday of North Korean founder Kim Il Sung, raising questions among analysts whether Pyongyang, as in some of its past terrorism, used proxies to carry out the attack in the U.S.

North Korea in recent weeks has been threatening the U.S. with attacks, including a pre-emptive nuclear strike. Pyongyang also has a history of committing terrorist attacks without taking credit for them.
I'm not saying that's it, but until more definite information is in, it's a line of inquiry.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Don Firth
Date: 18 Apr 13 - 01:13 AM

Songwronger, give my congratulations to David Horowitz next time you see him, for the astounding number of Right-Wing, anti-Liberal, anti-Obama web sites that he's managed to flood the internet with.

He certainly is a busy fellow.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 18 Apr 13 - 01:13 AM

>>From: kendall - PM
Date: 17 Apr 13 - 07:45 PM

There is no such thing as a senseless attack. It made sense to the creeps who did it. <<

I guess you are right Kendell but does what makes sense to them make sense?

For instance, killing 13 people in a movie theater because you think you are the Joker?


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Songwronger
Date: 17 Apr 13 - 08:05 PM

http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/p480x480/15155_479089912163926_1654583610_n.jpg

A collage of photos. Navy Seals at the marathon, with black backpacks, etc. There are dozens and dozens of individual surveillance camera photos online, but someone did this collage.

It appears that the Boston police were told there would be a bomb drill. Then the military moved in and made it happen. The devices were crudely fashioned in order to make it look like a knuckledragger did it. For the past two days the government-controlled media has been linking Middle Eastern terrorists to "right-wing extremists." At least on 9/11 they made some attempt to obfuscate. This is insulting.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: kendall
Date: 17 Apr 13 - 07:45 PM

There is no such thing as a senseless attack. It made sense to the creeps who did it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Songwronger
Date: 17 Apr 13 - 07:12 PM

I didn't blame the bombing on Obama, Mr. Firth. But since you brought it up, he is a known associate of the bomber Bill Ayers. Does anyone know where Mr. Obama was when the marathon bombs went off? There were reports of a "dark-skinned man" acting suspiciously before the crime. Perhaps that was Mr. Obama. He and Mr. Ayers should definitely be brought in for a waterboarding session. Come to think of it, Mr. Obama has been killing children with bombs lately in other countries, so who knows. The FBI should look at him really hard. I think you're onto something, Mr. Firth. Good call.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 17 Apr 13 - 02:56 PM

Yes, Greg, the Jonestown Massacre had certain parallels with Waco, as well as considerable differences.
.............
The fact that there was no element of "martyr" to this episode, and so far no claim of responsibility, argue against this being an Islamist operation.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Wesley S
Date: 17 Apr 13 - 02:38 PM

What I think is both silly and sad about these situations is how the local media here {Atlanta} covers the story. They are so desperate to make a connection with it.

"Coming up next - our exclusive interview with a local man who ran the Boston Marathon - finished early - and didn't see a thing". "And then we'll talk with a woman who's daughter never finished and she's safe too".

I imagine it's that way all over.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: jacqui.c
Date: 17 Apr 13 - 12:43 PM

I just got an email from our congresswoman, Chellie Pingree giving a donation web address - I am aware that there are scams out there but this one is the official one from the governor of Massachusetts so have donated there.


Massachusetts Governor Deval Patrick and Boston Mayor Tom Menino have formed The One Fund Boston to help the families most affected by the attack.

If you'd like to donate, you can do so here:


http://onefundboston.org/


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: jacqui.c
Date: 17 Apr 13 - 11:04 AM

I can't give blood - as a Brit they won't take me - something to do with Jacob Creutzfeldt disease. I am also a cancer survivor, which puts me totally outside the loop. I will be checking on a way to donate.


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Subject: RE: BS: Explosions at Boston Marathon
From: Rapparee
Date: 17 Apr 13 - 09:36 AM

So stay indoors and never leave your house again.

Dammit, Jacqui's right. Worrying and jumping to conclusions without sufficient data wastes your energy and makes you look stupid. Do something to help instead. You can at least give blood or money.


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