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Fascists Close St George event?

mikesamwild 30 Apr 10 - 09:12 AM
Fred McCormick 30 Apr 10 - 08:47 AM
mikesamwild 30 Apr 10 - 07:41 AM
Richard Bridge 30 Apr 10 - 05:05 AM
Ruth Archer 29 Apr 10 - 06:42 PM
Folkiedave 29 Apr 10 - 06:23 PM
Fred McCormick 29 Apr 10 - 08:41 AM
mikesamwild 29 Apr 10 - 07:39 AM
Crow Sister (off with the fairies) 29 Apr 10 - 06:58 AM
Dave the Gnome 29 Apr 10 - 06:23 AM
Crow Sister (off with the fairies) 29 Apr 10 - 05:55 AM
Crow Sister (off with the fairies) 29 Apr 10 - 05:53 AM
Dave the Gnome 29 Apr 10 - 05:37 AM
goatfell 29 Apr 10 - 05:27 AM
Ruth Archer 29 Apr 10 - 05:15 AM
Ruth Archer 29 Apr 10 - 05:09 AM
TheSnail 29 Apr 10 - 04:50 AM
Crow Sister (off with the fairies) 29 Apr 10 - 03:59 AM
Crow Sister (off with the fairies) 29 Apr 10 - 03:56 AM
Dave the Gnome 29 Apr 10 - 02:35 AM
Crow Sister (off with the fairies) 29 Apr 10 - 02:28 AM
Pierre Le Chapeau 28 Apr 10 - 07:48 PM
Pierre Le Chapeau 28 Apr 10 - 07:33 PM
Mick Woods 28 Apr 10 - 07:31 PM
mikesamwild 28 Apr 10 - 03:31 PM
The Sandman 28 Apr 10 - 12:34 PM
Mick Woods 28 Apr 10 - 12:02 PM
Rob Naylor 28 Apr 10 - 11:34 AM
IanC 28 Apr 10 - 11:32 AM
Penny S. 28 Apr 10 - 11:07 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Apr 10 - 10:43 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Apr 10 - 09:52 AM
mikesamwild 28 Apr 10 - 09:40 AM
buddhuu 28 Apr 10 - 07:26 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Apr 10 - 06:53 AM
Fred McCormick 28 Apr 10 - 06:24 AM
Ruth Archer 28 Apr 10 - 05:26 AM
Fred McCormick 28 Apr 10 - 05:10 AM
Dave the Gnome 27 Apr 10 - 06:09 PM
Richard Bridge 27 Apr 10 - 03:55 PM
Steve Gardham 27 Apr 10 - 03:52 PM
TheSnail 27 Apr 10 - 01:59 PM
mikesamwild 27 Apr 10 - 01:43 PM
Ruth Archer 27 Apr 10 - 10:59 AM
mikesamwild 27 Apr 10 - 09:22 AM
TheSnail 27 Apr 10 - 06:50 AM
Richard Bridge 27 Apr 10 - 06:26 AM
TheSnail 27 Apr 10 - 05:49 AM
Richard Bridge 27 Apr 10 - 05:18 AM
Dave the Gnome 27 Apr 10 - 04:14 AM
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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: mikesamwild
Date: 30 Apr 10 - 09:12 AM

Nice one Fred. watch it they'll have you as their spin doctor!


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 30 Apr 10 - 08:47 AM

Richard Bridge. "Funny, I'm sure that the BNP used to refer to the Irish as "Bogwogs"."

Richard, you're probably right. We are dealing with a bunch of opportunists who will say absolutely anything, and take absolutely any stance, if they think it will help them get into power. EG., how far back does their currrent espousal of Winston Churchill and the spirit of World War 11 go? It's not that long ago that leading lights in the BNP used to argue that we should have been on the side of Hitler instead of entering into a "totally unnecessary" war. And what did they call that gollywog they tried to hang last year in Codnor? Oh yeah, Winston, that was it.

Then there are their sudden changes on global warming and Iraq/Afghanistan, Griffin's reversal over holocaust denial, their denials that they are fascists, and their attempts to play down the BNP's racism.

Any day now I expect them to unveil a new front organisation to combat the "menace" of far right extremism. I can see its name up in lights right now. Fascists Against Fascism.

Ok, all politicians have a long piece of elastic which they call the truth, but Jesus! This crowd wouldn't know the truth if it got off the floor and bit them on the leg. And in case anybody thinks I'm dreaming over BNP claims to combat fascism, it's right there in the new edition of their constitution.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: mikesamwild
Date: 30 Apr 10 - 07:41 AM

This thread is drifting out to the Irish Sea. If we go for the 'Celtic' link then see the thread on The Irish were Egyptians long ago , cos they built the pyramids and noone ese could carry up the bricks!It must have been a Doyle that swam the River Noyle cos noone else would have the guts to fight a crocodoile! Good old stereotype and I come from an Irish family.

Mind all the empty houses in Ireland could be used for all the people Mr G would expel.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 30 Apr 10 - 05:05 AM

Funny, I'm sure that the BNP used to refer to the Irish as "Bogwogs".


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 06:42 PM

The whole "the Irish are just like us" agenda is predicated on a desire to consolidate the support of all white people in the UK against those of a darker hue, and it's no coincidence that the BNP is currently growing its support in Northern Ireland. Not that I would link to their website, but there is a publication currently being touted by the BNP which puts forward some crackpot theory about a common British genetic heritage that includes the Irish, and supposedly pre-dates various Saxon and Norman invasions - and claims that some huge number of people in the UK and Ireland still share this genetic heritage.

The reason for all of this, of course, if you read their propaganda, is because the BNP's current folk devil is not the Eastern Europeans, but Muslims. They are trying to convince everyone who lives in these islands that they have a common heritage which should unite against the threat of the "Islamification" of Britain.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Folkiedave
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 06:23 PM

Good idea Fred, let's encourage the bastard to go to O'Connell Street and do just that.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 08:41 AM

Sorry if this is getting further and further off topic. However, I've just heard the odious Mr G spouting his repatriation smokescreen, sorry, policy, or Radio 4's today programme http://news.bbc.co.uk/today/hi/today/newsid_8650000/8650909.stm .

Among his more stupid comments was something to the effect that Ireland is a part of Britain and therefore, Irish people would not be barred from entry.

Go on Griffin, I dare you. Stand in O'Connell St in Dublin, armed with a megaphone and shout "Ireland is British". Just see how long it is before somebody puts you right.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: mikesamwild
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 07:39 AM

CrowSister I was merely commenting o lack of support for a particular concert by black american musicians here in Sheffield. I'm sure people support the music of their own people. World Music audiences do seem mainly white British over here. I organized a large festival a few years back and got very little interst from the local 'minority population' for groups form all over the world. Maybe the venues are alienating, although a lot were in their local areas.

Mind you the big open air reggae and Dub Step etc events get suport from the youth which cut across all boundaries.

Maybe 'folk'as a genre orlabel just isn't what is interesting to them.My 5 sons were raised ( or dragged )to trad music and have gone into other forms. Mea Culpa ;-)


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 06:58 AM

"Maybe the FaF permathread would do for advice and help running events?"

DofE, I think as well as broader advice, it might be worth having a constructive specific discussion about strategies to help volunteers manage and hopefully diffuse problematic issues surrounding possible threats of violence etc.? How to approach landlords as hosts, how to circumvent possible problems of confrontation and so-on. I think recognising potential issues and offering constructive strategies to address them, might possibly help to put some peeps minds at rest.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 06:23 AM

Maybe the FaF permathread would do for advice and help running events? I would need to check with da management but I can't see any issue with that.

D.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 05:55 AM

Hmm, maybe it'd be worth starting an advice thread for peeps interested in creating 'community folk events'.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 05:53 AM

"So go for it, Crowsister - it may not be within the immediate (or even long-term) remit of the FAFcore, but it could certainly be within yours!"

Maybe! Although tbh I'm not in an area where there's any immigration at all to speak of. However, it seems I've possibly got a lot to learn about events management if I'm interested in actively pursuing some of my musings. Is there anywhere on the web which provides a 'crash course' in making things happen, for amateur enthusiasts like me? It would be helpful to get a broad grasp of basic practical stuff, and possible hiccoughs to avoid too.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 05:37 AM

Is that anything like 'I feel like a new woman', Ruth? :-)

We did indeed organise a multicultural festival once. We had the Orlek Cossack Dancers who, although mainly English themselves, did bring a lot of family and friends from the Ukraine, Poland and Russia. We also booked Tuup (pronounced toop - Important later) - A wonderful story teller from Ghana who doubled with a local Lancashire story teller in a loose sort of way and between them named their event 'two-up, one down':-)

For me it was one of our best festivals, but (didn't you know there was one of them coming!) we could not have done it without extra funding from North West Arts as they were at the time. I must say though that the funding was quite easy to raise in light of the fact that we were raisung the profile of the event to include an audience that were previously unserved. Which is, I think, a good thing for all concerned.

One aside - Tuup ended up at the wrong pub - another White Lion about 5 miles down the same road, in a particularly depressed area. He had a chat with a couple of people there to get directions and they came along later to see him - Added bonus!

Cheers

DeG


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: goatfell
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 05:27 AM

you had the SPinners from Liverpool they had a black man called Cliff Hall and what iswrong with that.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 05:15 AM

Good lord - I feel like David Cameron.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 05:09 AM

"PS, some of my comments are probably beyond the current and immediate remit of an org. like FAF, but in the long-term, maybe?"

To clarify what the "organisation" of FAF consists of: it's 5 people. All of whom have other commitments and jobs. FAF the "organisation" doesn't really have a remit to take on major projects - the event on Sunday has been about as much as we can all cope with, in terms of balancing our commitments. The whole point of FAF is that it's a bottom-up organisation, where people can take whatever tools, ideas and support they need, and get on with doing great things. FAF is not just us five - it's all the people who run events and projects.

So go for it, Crowsister - it may not be within the immediate (or even long-term) remit of the FAFcore, but it could certainly be within yours!


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: TheSnail
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 04:50 AM

Excellent ideas, Crow Sister. When you've organised the first event, let us know.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 03:59 AM

PS, some of my comments are probably beyond the current and immediate remit of an org. like FAF, but in the long-term, maybe?


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 03:56 AM

The session in pub after was one of the best I have ever attended!"

Yes, I can imagine. And this is one of the things that brings people of different cultures together. Shared enjoyment. Fun. A Laugh!

A second point to my first about the notion of positively targeting towns with high eastern European immigration, is the idea of FAMILY days. Much of the UK folk world is stuck away in the backroom of pubs and so-on. It'd be good to see more moves to bring British folk out into the sunshine lots more, along the line of some of the free folk fests that are already out there - but making something really local, that represented and celebrated the demographic of the particular area.

But especially where there were opportunities for KIDS of all backgrounds to get together and enjoy singing and storytelling and so-on from the various cultures of the area. The next generation is really the key to everything, and encouraging them at an early age to engage with one others folk culture can only be a good thing.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 02:35 AM

Google 'event cancelled bnp' M. La Chapeau. It is not difficult. You will find this and many other examples.

Crowsis - About the East Europeans - Yes, definitely. We had a 'multi-cultural' event in Salford some years ago. The event itself was staged and OK but a bit dull. The session in pub after was one of the best I have ever attended! Polish singers, Bosnian fiddlers, Slovak Guitarists. Fully integrated with the locals and absolutley wonderful.

Cheers

DeG


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 02:28 AM

"The number of 'black faces' represented in English folk is well established as shown by the number of acts from black and other ethnic origins that are well known in the 'folk circuit'. What would you suggest? Force people who are not interested in folk music and morris dance to support it?"

FAF and all 'activists' interested in generating a greater inclusive band of interest from ALL members of the UK (such as the white English working-classes, eastern European immigrants and settled urban Blacks etc. etc.) face quite a challenge to educate and encourage people from a variety of backgrounds to realise this stuff is here for you to enjoy and participate in.

However with particular reference to eastern Europeans - who are arguably getting the greatest negative focus from the far right at present - I think there could be a great deal of potential interest for co-operation between eastern European folk musicians and trad. English/British folk artists.

Public Summer FAF events, organised in some of those towns more recently settled by higher quantities of eastern Europeans (and thus of interest to the BNP), could both showcase native folk arts and that of the immigrant population, hopefully in a way that works positively for all.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Pierre Le Chapeau
Date: 28 Apr 10 - 07:48 PM

I have access for much recent news at work may it be national or village?


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Pierre Le Chapeau
Date: 28 Apr 10 - 07:33 PM

If this serious event is true re threats and closure and the Police wouldnt do anything about it why have I not read anything regarding the incident in the papers? Where was this incident and what was the name of the pub ? and exactly who was behind the threats?

I work in a public building and I can find no trace.
Kindest regards Pierre.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Mick Woods
Date: 28 Apr 10 - 07:31 PM

These are the current "HeadY Days" embrace them - enjoy the music - don't get sucked into the quagmire!


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: mikesamwild
Date: 28 Apr 10 - 03:31 PM

Mick Woods , that's great news reminds me of the heady days of two tone music! a common opposition to 'Nationalists'


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: The Sandman
Date: 28 Apr 10 - 12:34 PM

I wrote a song about Edmund called the Curse of Hoxne bridge,There is supposed to be a curse on this bridge which related to newly married couples,Edmund was betrayed by a newly wed couple ,legend has it he was hiding under the bridge,and a newly married couple were going over the bridge and spotted Edmund,and reported his hiding place to the danes
The song is in my songbook The Sailors Dream.
I had no idea that Edmund was the patron saint of England before George,perhaps we should START celerating St Edmunds Day as well,I believe its nov 20.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Mick Woods
Date: 28 Apr 10 - 12:02 PM

"It's a sad bad fact that very few black people are interested in folk music"

This is certainly not the case at the folk club that I and two friends run every Tuesday at Blackheath Folk Club And if you listen to the MP3 by young Immanuel that is on the front of our website, he sings "You welcome me with open arms" We now number at least half a dozen regular Black and Asian performers. This brings a rich quality and diversity to our weekly sessions that are becoming so popular that the Pub is packed by 9pm every week!


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Rob Naylor
Date: 28 Apr 10 - 11:34 AM

It's not just that May Day has been politicised at various times: I can think of at least 2 formerly regular events locally that have been cancelled due to HSE/ insurance issues...one village event was quoted £3000 insurance premium for a single day, just to put up a maypole, some stalls and a bit of music. What parish council's going to cover that?


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: IanC
Date: 28 Apr 10 - 11:32 AM

St George is quite interesting and, I think, very appropriate as a patron for England.

Firstly, since patrons don't supplant each other, England has 3 patron saints ... Edmund The Martyr(d.869), Edward "The Confessor"(d.1066) and George of Lydda (d.275-285 approx) ... all of them are, in the original, examples of Christian forbearance.

Forget the dragon (a far later tale). George was chosen by the Normans because of his appearance to their armies (from 1063 onwards) and leading them from defeat to Victory. Before that, though, George was very important in England. He was mentioned as a seminal Christian figure by Bede (c730) and there were a relatively large number of English churches dedicated to George before the conquest. The original George was executed by beheading after various torture sessions, during which he continued to object to the Romans' cruel treatment of Christians.

We didn't just forget our other patrons either. St Edmund's banner was carried at the battle of Agincourt

:-)
Ian


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Penny S.
Date: 28 Apr 10 - 11:07 AM

In a recent history magazine - don't know if it was the Beeb one or History Today, there was an interesting suggestion made about the adoption of St George for England. Not only did he supplant Edward the Confessor after the return of the Crusaders, but the change came under Edward II, just before he went into Wales. Not good, if you think about it.

Penny


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Apr 10 - 10:43 AM

Sorry - toO difficult - I was not addressing you as difficult Mike - Honest!


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Apr 10 - 09:52 AM

el Gnomo do your own homework

To difficult, Mike - I would need to go to Sheffield and check what colour all the performers were under their various disguises, check the ethnicity ratio of the crowd against that of the performers and then make up some facts to fit the theory. And I am no politician:-)

Cheers

DeG


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: mikesamwild
Date: 28 Apr 10 - 09:40 AM

el Gnomo do your own homework I was commenting on that particular video which I think would send out the wrong signal in multicultural Sheffield. Fred ,black people might be interested in their folk music. I agree about the Chocolate Drops, at a concert in Sheffield there was only one person of colour and she's a folkie. I bet if you put on a blues artist black peole wouldn't turn out and I've seen very few at 'World Music' festivals either., they've moved on and that may be why the Chocolate Drops are seen as an anachronism ( I loved them mind). Billy Connolly told a tale of a black Anmerican who said ' bros don't like yeehah and banjos! when he saw Billy's banjo tattoo'


Ruth I'd like to hear your views, can you start another thread as the Gnome suggested?.


After my earlier post I fell to wondering why St George's Day is such a non-event. Maybe we should go back to Mayday on May 1st whenever it falls and have a traditional day of misrule to equal St Patrick's Day. Green Persons all over the place rustling their leaves, black faced chimney sweeps, milkmaids, etc etc . Then back on your heads next day and social order reestablished. The toffs and their agents always did win!.


I think MayDay was wrecked by the powersthatbe because of its perceived Red connections - and it was appropriated, again by Left and Right ite past. Now you have to go to Padstow to get a taste of it or some of the revivals..


Where are you hgoing for MayDay 1st or 7th?


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: buddhuu
Date: 28 Apr 10 - 07:26 AM

@ Fred: I'd never heard of that band. They're fun. Thanks for the tip! :-)


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Apr 10 - 06:53 AM

Worth a separate thread? Although I think it has been discussed before.

DeG


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 28 Apr 10 - 06:24 AM

Ruth,

True, but I'm thinking of the real bad old days in the 60s and 70s when the revival was uncomfortably claustrophobic in its approach to music. The era could be summed up by one nutter who complained about "foreign" folk music being broadcast on Folk on 2 (I think). "I felt like a foreigner in my own country".

Wouldn't it be grand if black people could be persuaded to dig the Carolina Chocolate Drops.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 28 Apr 10 - 05:26 AM

"But to what extent is it also due to those folk revivalists who used to believe that the only folk music worth listening to was British and white?"

Well...the world music phenomenon, which wiped the floor with British folk commercially in the 80s and 90s, was all about traditional music from other places, notably Africa and South East Asia. One of the things that you'd notice, though, at gigs or if you went to festivals like Womad, is that the audiences were still predominantly white. This is why I don't really buy this idea that folk music attracts mostly white audiences because of trends within the revival, or because of some inherent sense of "this isn't for you, it's only for us" - because programming music by black artists within genres that are deeply rooted within black traditional music does not necessarily translate to substantial black audiences, either.

I've got lots of theories about the whys and wherefores of this (because of the work I've done in culturally diverse audience development), but I won't bore you with them. :)


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 28 Apr 10 - 05:10 AM

It's a sad bad fact that very few black people are interested in folk music. Ok., that's partly because they have their own music and good luck to them. But to what extent is it also due to those folk revivalists who used to believe that the only folk music worth listening to was British and white?

BNP thickos. One of the tv news channels was in Oldham yesterday, discussing the effect of immigration on the local parliamentary vote. They asked to speak to the BNP candidate. "Oh, he's not giving interviews until after the election." After some badgering the party apparatchiks seem to have told the reporter that their candidate wasn't even in the northwest!

Obviously too embarressing for the BNP to say they hadn't a hope in hell of winning in Oldham, so they'd appointed a paper candidate, who wasn't capable of giving interviews. Did the nazis look this ludicrous when they got going?


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 27 Apr 10 - 06:09 PM

I would suggest you do your homework mikesamwild. The number of 'black faces' represented in English folk is well established as shown by the number of acts from black and other ethnic origins that are well known in the 'folk circuit'. What would you suggest? Force people who are not interested in folk music and morris dance to support it? We just have to accept that traditional arts are a minority in themselves. Within that minority we are lucky to have the support of some people from all races, colour and creeds. Maybe we just don't appeal to the majority of black youngsters, just as we don't appeal to the majority of white ones either!

Cheers

DeG


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 27 Apr 10 - 03:55 PM

Snail, I can wholeheartedly agree with that.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 27 Apr 10 - 03:52 PM

From all the folk-related BNP activities I'd say there was a perfect TV documentary in there. Now, who do we know who can pull some strings? Let's out the bastards!


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: TheSnail
Date: 27 Apr 10 - 01:59 PM

mikesamwild

Is British culture all white or is it already appropriated without the BNP muscling in?

Isn't the idea that being white and being interested in British traditional music makes you a BNP supporter precisely what we are fighting against?


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: mikesamwild
Date: 27 Apr 10 - 01:43 PM

No black faces apert from the made up Molly Dancers. Is British culture all white or is it already appropriated without the BNP muscling in? St George is patroon saint of lots of countries, creeds and ethnicity already, although he does seem to get involved in mumming plays that slay dusky Saracens etc so maybe he's been mixed up wih Crusaders although he was a Christian Roman soldier in pagan times ( the Dragon may have been the perceived pagan threat after he was taken up by the Roman empire and later the church) Now he can be claimed as a champion by other groups so we have a struggle . Maybe it's time for a non canonised secular, non racist national hero/heroine. Any suggestions?

I must say i love Morris and wouldn't just want the odd token steel band thrown in either ! Maybe next year a truly representative day would be nice.

The video wasn't FAF it was of the Council backed event


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 27 Apr 10 - 10:59 AM

Made by FAF supporters in Sheffield


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: mikesamwild
Date: 27 Apr 10 - 09:22 AM

It could be that other regulars weren't to keen either for various reasons and put some pressure on.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: TheSnail
Date: 27 Apr 10 - 06:50 AM

Leaving me a little unclear on what you are attacking me for.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 27 Apr 10 - 06:26 AM

I have read the entire thread more than once.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: TheSnail
Date: 27 Apr 10 - 05:49 AM

Please don't attack for what I haven't said, Richard. Read my first post. The landlord has lost the support of the the event organisers, he won't go to the police and the BNP now see him as a pushover. Do you really think his family are safer for his decision? Should the two landlords that Bernard spoke of have given in to the drug pushers to save their pubs?

I'm not asking for individual acts of heroism. I'm asking for a united front against the bastards. Isn't that what this is about?


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 27 Apr 10 - 05:18 AM

Snail - you may risk what you like, (and maximum respect if you do) but it is not your place nor anyone else's to risk the lives of others.


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Subject: RE: Fascists Close St George event?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 27 Apr 10 - 04:14 AM

A stand CAN be taken sucessfuly by co-operation between police and public but it does take some doing - and often a kick up the pants for the contabulary. A pub a couple of miles from us, The Rainscough Brew, (Used to be the Staff of Life - On Rainscough Brow) was featured on TV as being a centre of drug pushing and protection rackets in Salford. The police were shown up in a bad light and of course that spurred them into action - The place was cleaned up within weeks and stayed so for years.

It has been demolished since, but nothing to do with crime. Probably lack of custom seeing as it was only criminals used to drink there!

Morals? Well, one may be that not everyone wants their pubs cleaned up but if they do - Get the police on your side!

Cheers

DeG


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