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HTML Practice Thread

Tiger 03 Aug 99 - 03:32 PM
Tiger 03 Aug 99 - 03:36 PM
Tiger 03 Aug 99 - 03:37 PM
Sandy Paton 04 Aug 99 - 02:21 AM
Joe Offer 04 Aug 99 - 04:32 AM
AndyG 04 Aug 99 - 04:50 AM
Joe Offer 04 Aug 99 - 05:27 AM
Joe Offer 04 Aug 99 - 05:30 AM
Joe Offer 04 Aug 99 - 05:32 AM
AndyG 04 Aug 99 - 05:37 AM
AndyG 04 Aug 99 - 05:46 AM
Alan of Australia 04 Aug 99 - 05:55 AM
Sandy Paton 04 Aug 99 - 10:39 PM
Sandy Paton 04 Aug 99 - 10:45 PM
Joe Offer 04 Aug 99 - 10:45 PM
Sandy Paton 04 Aug 99 - 11:02 PM
Joe Offer 04 Aug 99 - 11:06 PM
Sandy Paton 04 Aug 99 - 11:07 PM
Tony Burns 05 Aug 99 - 08:01 AM
AndyG 05 Aug 99 - 08:53 AM
Tony Burns 05 Aug 99 - 09:09 AM
AndyG 05 Aug 99 - 09:56 AM
Tony Burns 05 Aug 99 - 10:14 AM
marion 05 Aug 99 - 10:30 AM
Celtic-End Singer 05 Aug 99 - 10:13 PM
Celtic-End Singer 06 Aug 99 - 01:04 AM
Joe Offer 06 Aug 99 - 02:41 AM
Liam's Brother 06 Aug 99 - 07:07 AM
Joe Offer 07 Aug 99 - 04:21 AM
Barbara 07 Aug 99 - 03:08 PM
Barbara 07 Aug 99 - 03:15 PM
Joe Offer 07 Aug 99 - 03:32 PM
Bill D 07 Aug 99 - 06:32 PM
Bill D 07 Aug 99 - 07:18 PM
Joe Offer 07 Aug 99 - 09:07 PM
Joe Offer 07 Aug 99 - 09:11 PM
Max 13 Aug 99 - 01:41 PM
Mike Regenstreif 13 Aug 99 - 05:34 PM
Mike Regenstreif 13 Aug 99 - 05:36 PM
Lesley N. 13 Aug 99 - 06:50 PM
Bill D 13 Aug 99 - 11:07 PM
Bill D 13 Aug 99 - 11:20 PM
j0_77 13 Aug 99 - 11:46 PM
WyoWoman 14 Aug 99 - 01:23 AM
WyoWoman 14 Aug 99 - 01:26 AM
davidmc24 15 Aug 99 - 09:41 PM
Bill D 15 Aug 99 - 09:45 PM
HaHa 15 Aug 99 - 10:16 PM
HaHa 15 Aug 99 - 10:22 PM
Jeri 15 Aug 99 - 11:12 PM
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Subject: HTML Practice Thread
From: Tiger
Date: 03 Aug 99 - 03:32 PM

After screwing up yet another attempt to add some simple formatting to a lyric, I came up with the idea of a practice thread where we can try out stuff before we submit it.

Unfortunately, the Mudcat edit process does funny things with paragraph marks, carriage returns, and the like, and the picture is further complicated by options you may have set in your word processor.

So, why not practice here? Before you mess up a pretty lyric, make sure it gets through the Mudcat filters unscathed. Save Joe some work!!! The thread can be periodically dumped and restarted.

I'm gonna try my last screw-up again as an example.

Also...Joe, Max, et al - if you'd rather we cut down on HTML, please speak up. Myself, I don't try much more than bolding, indents and line breaks, but I still get in trouble.

.....Tiger


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Tiger
Date: 03 Aug 99 - 03:36 PM

Maybe this will be better.

Hi, Beau.......

Well, here's how I do it. The key is E, playing D formation with capo on the second fret. You can fancy it up nicely by adding Dsus4 and/or A7sus4 (easily done without moving from D position).

......Tiger

No Man's Land - Eric Bogle

Well, [D]how do you do, young [G]Willie Mc-[Em]Bride,
Do you [A7]mind if I sit here, down [G]by your grave-[D]side,
And rest for a while in the [G]warm summer [Em]sun?
I've been [A7]working all day, and [G]I'm nearly [D]done.

I [D]see by your gravestone you were [G]only nine-[Em]teen
When you [A7]joined great fallen in [G]19-[A7]16.
I [D]hope you died well, and I [G]hope you died [Em]clean,
Or, for [A7]Willie McBride, was it [G]slow and ob-[D]scene?

    CHORUS (Each stanza)
    Did they [A7]beat the drum slowly, did they [G]play the fife [D]lowly,
    Did they [A7]sound the dead march as they [G]lowered you [A7]down?
    Did the [G]band play the [A7]Last Post and [D]chorus,
    Did the [G]pipes play "The [Em]Flowers of the [A7]For-[D]est"?


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Tiger
Date: 03 Aug 99 - 03:37 PM

Well, all right, then!!!!!


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Sandy Paton
Date: 04 Aug 99 - 02:21 AM

Jolly good show, lad! Now tell me how to make indents in HTML (Joe, I know you're lurking out there!). I'd like to be able to indent the beginning lines of the paragraphs in any of my posts that grow overlong. Indents would avoid the blank spaces between paragraphs that many of us use now. Perhaps this isn't going to be really necessary, as a excellent solution would be simply to stick to shorter posts! Right?

Sandy


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 04 Aug 99 - 04:32 AM

Well, Sandy, then you have to graduate into the wicked ampersand codes. They all begin with an ampersand and end with a semicolon. the one you want for indents is multiple non-breaking spaces, abbreviated NBSP. One non-breaking space looks like this:

 

Got that? ampersand-nbsp-semicolon. Don't ask me how I get that to display - the code for that would drive you bonkers. A non-operating ampersand it & - and it gets more complicated after that.
Not the trick that keeps you from going crazy is that you highlight and copy [ctrl-c] the first code and paste [ctrl-v] it into place for the other spaces.
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: AndyG
Date: 04 Aug 99 - 04:50 AM

Actually Joe, the tags you want are the
<dl>
<dt>
<dd>
</dt>
</dl>
list formatting tags

which will give
multiple indents
thus
AndyG


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 04 Aug 99 - 05:27 AM

I knew there had to be an easier way, but the nonbreaking space method was what somebody told me about a while back. Andy, I don't quite see how to use those tags. Please explain. I looked at the source of this page to see how you typed it, but it still didn't make sense to me.
Thanks.
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 04 Aug 99 - 05:30 AM

It
didn't
work.

-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 04 Aug 99 - 05:32 AM

OK
one
more
try
Did it work?
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: ADD: The Prickle Holly Bush^^
From: AndyG
Date: 04 Aug 99 - 05:37 AM

Joe,

The following should, I hope, help. Use view source and I hope you'll see how "editable" the text is and also be able to follow how the nested list structure works. (I've modified this text from one of my web pages for this example.)

AndyG

The Prickle Holly Bush

Come slack your horse cries George,
Come slack it for a while,
For I think I see my father,
Coming over yonder stile.

Have you brought gold,have you brought silver,
To set me free,
For to keep my body from the cold gaol walls,
And my neck from the high gallows tree.

I've no gold,I've no silver,
To set you free,
For I have come for to see you hang,
All hang upon the high gallows tree.

Oh the Prickle Holly Bush,it pricks,it pricks,
It pricks my heart full sore,
And if ever I get out of the prickle holly bush,
I'll never get in there any more.

Come slack your horse cries George,
Come slack it for a while,
For I think I see my mother,
Coming over yonder stile.

Etc.

Come slack your horse cries George,
Come slack it for a while,
For I think I see my sister,
Coming over yonder stile.

Etc.

Come slack your horse cries George,
Come slack it for a while,
For I think I see my sweet-heart,
Coming over yonder stile.

Have you brought gold,have you brought silver,
To set me free,
For to keep my body from the cold gaol walls,
And my neck from the high gallows tree.

I've brought gold,I've brought silver,
To set you free,
For I don't think to see you hang,
All hang upon the high gallows tree.

Oh the prickle holly bush it pricks it pricks,
It pricks my heart full sore,
And if ever I get out of the prickle holly bush,
I'll never get in there any more.

^^


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: AndyG
Date: 04 Aug 99 - 05:46 AM

Sorry Joe,
In my rush to help I forgot about the way the forum software handles text, (sigh).
If you point your browser to The Prickle Holly Bush you'll see what I mean about "editability" and be able to see the structure.

AndyG


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Alan of Australia
Date: 04 Aug 99 - 05:55 AM

G'day,
I suppose I'm being a killjoy if I say that you can do the whole thing offline, in the privacy of your own home, saving you the embarrassment of the whole world seeing your mistakes:

a) Type it into notepad,
b) Save it with a .htm extension,
c) Double click on the saved file - your browser should open with your text laid out as you want (well if you got it right anyway)
d) When it's right copy it from notepad & paste it to Mudcat.

Cheers,
Alan


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Sandy Paton
Date: 04 Aug 99 - 10:39 PM

Gawdamighty! I really opened a can of worms, didn't I?
<&mbsp;><&mbsp;><&mbsp;><&mbsp;><&mbsp;>Like this, Joe?
<&mbsp;><&mbsp;><&mbsp;>Sandy


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Sandy Paton
Date: 04 Aug 99 - 10:45 PM

Nope. Not like that, obviously! Better lead me through it again; I'm a slow learner.

Grandpa Paton


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 04 Aug 99 - 10:45 PM

Try again, Sandy. Non-Breaking SPace begins with a different letter, and the ampersand codes aren't enclosed in angle brackets.
      If I did it right, this line is indented five spaces, and it should be underlined and in blue.
I'm still working on understanding Andy's tags, but the nonbreaking spaces should work in the meantime.
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Sandy Paton
Date: 04 Aug 99 - 11:02 PM

Alan's suggestion that we try this in the privacy of our own homes makes a lot of sense. I've never been fond of public humiliation.
     Is that five spaces?
   Cyberklutz himself.


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 04 Aug 99 - 11:06 PM

I kinda like public humiliation myself, as long as I'm not the one being humiliated. Sandy, this is labeled as a practice thread, so eventually I'll copy the good stuff over to the main HTML thread, and I'll delete your mistakes so you can maintain the delusion of perfection.
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Sandy Paton
Date: 04 Aug 99 - 11:07 PM

YAHOO! The bloody thing can COUNT 'em! Thanks, Joe. I'll work on the others when I can understand them a little.
     Sandy


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Tony Burns
Date: 05 Aug 99 - 08:01 AM

Joe, What Andy has done is to use the definition list tags for a purpose other than intended. The DT tage is for Definition Term and DD is Definition Data. Think of it as a dictionary usage. By not supplying data to the DT tag you seem to get an indent. Below is an example with data provided for these two tags and (hopefully) readable tags used to produce it.

Term 1
The definition 1
Term 2
The definition 2

<dl>
<dt>Term 1
<dd>The definition 1
</dt>
<dt>Term 2
<dd>The definition 2
</dt>
</dl>

btw - If you don't need nested indents you can use the <blockquote> </blockquote> pair of tags.


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: AndyG
Date: 05 Aug 99 - 08:53 AM

Whilst I'll freely admit to an interpretive use of HTML's definition list structure, I have to say it's the best I've found. The <blockquote> </blockquote> tags for instance put a blank line before and after the quoted text and I know of no way to supress this feature. Heavy use of embedded whitespace (&nbsp;) can make it very difficult to maintain the text content of the page in question.

AndyG


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Tony Burns
Date: 05 Aug 99 - 09:09 AM

I hope you didn't take my explanation as a critisism Andy. I was just trying to help Joe understand the definition list tags. I've used them as you described many times. What we really need here is a good <indent> tag.


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: AndyG
Date: 05 Aug 99 - 09:56 AM

Tony,

Nope, no offence taken.
I was just trying to say that as there is no inbuilt indenting function in HTML, I Regard the definition list tags as the best available choice.
I admit though that they take a bit of effort to use as the indenting is not the primary intention of the tag.

Joe,
Here's a (hopefully) better example of the list tag in use. At least it's documented. :)
Use view source to see what I'v done.

AndyG


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Tony Burns
Date: 05 Aug 99 - 10:14 AM

For those who are really interested you can read all about HTML 4.0 at http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40/.

I downloaded the .pdf version to read when I have trouble sleeping.


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: marion
Date: 05 Aug 99 - 10:30 AM

Fairy Reels A-Plenty


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Celtic-End Singer
Date: 05 Aug 99 - 10:13 PM


This is line one
This should be line two
This should be bold
This should blink


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Celtic-End Singer
Date: 06 Aug 99 - 01:04 AM


A MAN'S A MAN FOR A' THAT


(Robert Burns)
Is there for honest Poverty
That hings his head, and a' that?
The coward-slave, we pass him by,
We dare be poor for a' that!
For a' that, and a' that,
The rank is but the guinea's stamp,
The Man's the gowd for a' that!


What though on hamely fare we dine,
Wear hoddin grey, and a' that;
Gie fools their silks and knaves their wine,
A Man's a Man for a' that:
For a' that, and a' that,
Their tinsel show, and a' that;
The honest man, tho' e'er sae poor,
Is king o' men for a' that!



Ye see yon birkie ca'd a lord,
Wha struts, and stares, and a' that,
Though hundreds worship at his word,
He's but a coof for a' that:
For a' that, and a' that,
His ribband, star and a' that;
The man of independent mind
He looks and laughs at a' that.


A prince can mak a belted knight,
A marquis, duke and a' that;
But an honest man's aboon his might-
Gude faith, he mauna fa' that!
For a' that, and a' that,
Their dignities, and a' that;
The pith o' sense and pride o' worth
Are higher rank than a' that!


Then let us pray that come it may-
As come it will for a' that-
That Sense and Worth, o'er a' the earth,
May bear the gree, and a' that.
For a' that, and a' that,
It's comin' yet for a' that,
That Man to Man the world o'er,
Shall brothers be for a' that


hings = hangs
a' that = all that
hoddin grey = course home-made woollen cloth
birkie = fellow
coof = fool, ninny
aboon =above
mauna = must not
greesupremacy


Like all true nationalists, Burns was also an internationalist.

The first four lines of the first verse, the sense of which is often misunderstood, may be thus interpreted: "Is there anyone who hangs his head in shame at his poverty? If there is such a poor creature, we pass him by as a coward slave."

With reference to the seventh line of the first verse, a similar though occurs in Wycherley's "Plain-Dealer", which Burns may have seen: "I weigh the man, not his title; 'tis not the king's stamp can make the metal better or heavier. Your lord is a leaden shilling, which you bend every way, and which debases the stamp he bears."

As far as the fourth line of the fourth verse is concerned, "'Fa", as a noun, means lot or share; as a verb, to get or obtain. Burns here uses the word in a violent sense- "He must not attempt or pretend to have that as a thing in his power."


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 06 Aug 99 - 02:41 AM

Hi, Celtic. I hope you don't plan to use that

<h1>

headline size too often in the Forum, let you be thought of as "indiscreet." (grin)
Usually, I think that <big> is plenty, although you might want to use

<h2>

or maybe even

<h3>



For some reason, <blink> only works with Netscape, and
<marquee>
with Microsoft Internet Explorer (MSIE).
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Liam's Brother
Date: 06 Aug 99 - 07:07 AM


Heading


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 07 Aug 99 - 04:21 AM

Hi, Dan - when you've got more than one word in a post, make sure you close off that headline with </h2> - most HTML tags have to be closed when you're done with them [with a slash and a repeat of the command].
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Barbara
Date: 07 Aug 99 - 03:08 PM

*BLUSH*


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Barbara
Date: 07 Aug 99 - 03:15 PM

HELLO and GREETINGS and WARM and FUZZY and DELECTABLEand SWEET KISSES and HUGS fromBARBARA


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 07 Aug 99 - 03:32 PM

Gee, Barbara, you certainly used some unusual colors:
         Green
    and Cyan
    and Magenta
    and Chartreuse (you spelled it wrong, I think)
    and Orange
    and Purple
    and Pink
    and Tan
    and Mauve
-Joe Offer, playing with the
    <ul> tag-


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Bill D
Date: 07 Aug 99 - 06:32 PM

uhhh...for those who are dead serious about learning HTML....here is a page of ALL of it...lists, compatibility guides...links to examples...etc.

HTML Tag list and spec guide

!!be warned...this is a LONG page to load the first time...there may be easier ways...(if you have the space, you could download the entire page as is and always have it close ay hand...I have an HTML reading program called NavRoad which will open any HTML item on your hard drive and allow you to use it as an adjunct to your browser, etc...it also views pictures)


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Bill D
Date: 07 Aug 99 - 07:18 PM

here is the place to look at NavRoad and several sister programs this company has...their virtue is that they are configured for either browser, and they claim they will run on anything from a 286 up.....

Lots of neat HTML aids


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 07 Aug 99 - 09:07 PM

Hey, this is fun, bill!

<font color=#> ... </font>
#= #rrggbb Hex Number, or Name:
      Black, Olive, Teal, Red, Blue, Maroon, Navy, Gray, Lime,
      Fuchsia, White, Green, Purple, Silver, Yellow, Aqua


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Joe Offer
Date: 07 Aug 99 - 09:11 PM


Hi
there
everybody


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Max
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 01:41 PM

I was fooling around (as if I have nothing else to do) with the goal of trying to figure out a way to allow folks to use more style and such when posting a message without them needing to know HTML. Truth is, I've been thinking about this for 2 years or more, but have always held off because of browser compatability. Anyhow, I came up with this: Experimental HTML Thingy. It uses javascript. I suppose I'll just let a few of you play with it before I go to all the trouble of explaining it. Try it out.


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Mike Regenstreif
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 05:34 PM

Just testing...

Folk Roots/Folk Branches Blue Clicky Thing


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Mike Regenstreif
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 05:36 PM

another test

Folk Roots/Folk Branches


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Lesley N.
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 06:50 PM

I must say I haven't been on the thread before because I practice - that is screw up enough - coding my own pages - don't need the extra practice (except at typing at which I do 90 words a minute with 30 mistakes...)

However, I wandered by....

MAX now that is impressive - what a grand experimental thing! Are you going to make that generally available?

Used it to put this really good link for learning HTML in: HTML 4 Rookies


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Bill D
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 11:07 PM

neat,Max!!Make it a link on each thread page!


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Bill D
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 11:20 PM

tricks with Max's new toy

I love Mudacat
Yes, I do
My whole family
Loves it too.

Blue Clicky Thing for Possum Meat...and others


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: j0_77
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 11:46 PM

Now this is *cool*
Great stuff Max - mooooorrrreeee :)


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: WyoWoman
Date: 14 Aug 99 - 01:23 AM

Hey, Lesley, That was an excellent site. I've bookmarked it for future reference.

I still don't understand how to get those cool colors???

WyoWoman


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: WyoWoman
Date: 14 Aug 99 - 01:26 AM

Wowee Zowee!!!


It worked!!!

I'm so

jazzed!

Colors?????

WW


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: davidmc24
Date: 15 Aug 99 - 09:41 PM

For indentation, I would suggest using CSS attributes (CSS is an acronym, Cascading Style Sheets). CSS is a technology specifically designed to allow detailed formatting of web pages.

HTML is supposed to be primarily concerned with what the information IS, not what it looks like. In this way, a browser can display the content reasonably regardless of its output mechanism, be it a color display, a grayscale laptop LCD, a Braille writer, or a text-to-speech sythesis. When you use a tag for something other than its intended purpose (e.g., a definition list for indentation), you may well get unpredictable results in less common browsers.

If you use CSS for your formatting, you don't have to worry about this. (Though admittedly, CSS is only supported in IE3+ and Netscape 4+) For example, in CSS, you might use this HTML to achieve indentation of lyrics:
<div style="text-indent: .25in">This is text, indented a quarter inch</div>

This is text, indented a quarter inch

You don't have to use the style="" with only the DIV tag... you can use it with any tag that has a start and an end (paragraphs, bold, italic, etc.) I usually use DIV because it doesn't have any meaning in and of itself, and thus allows that tag to be only to apply my style information.


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Bill D
Date: 15 Aug 99 - 09:45 PM

hey...great, David...thanks...I need info like that!..so much to keep up with if you are not using it every day..


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: HaHa
Date: 15 Aug 99 - 10:16 PM

Those color words were interesting. The picture was a surprise! Let's see...

Blue Clicky Thing for more colors... and a puzzle!


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: HaHa
Date: 15 Aug 99 - 10:22 PM

Oops. So much for stealing other people's work!

Blue Clicky Thing for more colors... and a puzzle!


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Subject: RE: HTML Practice Thread
From: Jeri
Date: 15 Aug 99 - 11:12 PM

Click on the Celtic art thingie for more Celtic art.


Max, are image files allowed now?


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