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Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance

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BB 12 Feb 10 - 02:50 PM
Dave the Gnome 12 Feb 10 - 09:16 AM
Dave Hanson 12 Feb 10 - 08:33 AM
Folkiedave 12 Feb 10 - 08:12 AM
Dave the Gnome 12 Feb 10 - 03:48 AM
GUEST,Captain Jack Sparrow 12 Feb 10 - 02:45 AM
Jack Campin 11 Feb 10 - 08:56 PM
Flashmeister 11 Feb 10 - 08:21 PM
The Borchester Echo 11 Feb 10 - 06:47 PM
Lizzie Cornish 1 11 Feb 10 - 06:25 PM
The Borchester Echo 11 Feb 10 - 06:08 PM
Folkiedave 11 Feb 10 - 06:06 PM
Lizzie Cornish 1 11 Feb 10 - 06:05 PM
GUEST,Ralphie 11 Feb 10 - 05:59 PM
Lizzie Cornish 1 11 Feb 10 - 05:55 PM
Lizzie Cornish 1 11 Feb 10 - 05:51 PM
The Borchester Echo 11 Feb 10 - 05:51 PM
GUEST,Ralphie 11 Feb 10 - 05:50 PM
Lizzie Cornish 1 11 Feb 10 - 05:39 PM
Lizzie Cornish 1 11 Feb 10 - 05:33 PM
Lizzie Cornish 1 11 Feb 10 - 05:32 PM
Dave the Gnome 11 Feb 10 - 05:20 PM
GUEST,Ralphie 11 Feb 10 - 05:16 PM
Paco O'Barmy 11 Feb 10 - 05:02 PM
GUEST,glueperson googling 11 Feb 10 - 05:00 PM
Paco O'Barmy 11 Feb 10 - 04:52 PM
Folkiedave 11 Feb 10 - 04:39 PM
Ruth Archer 11 Feb 10 - 04:07 PM
Dave the Gnome 11 Feb 10 - 03:46 PM
Lizzie Cornish 1 11 Feb 10 - 03:42 PM
Dave the Gnome 11 Feb 10 - 03:36 PM
Lizzie Cornish 1 11 Feb 10 - 03:32 PM
The Borchester Echo 11 Feb 10 - 03:28 PM
Ruth Archer 11 Feb 10 - 03:14 PM
Lizzie Cornish 1 11 Feb 10 - 02:30 PM
GUEST,Spleen Cringe 11 Feb 10 - 12:33 PM
Folkiedave 11 Feb 10 - 12:18 PM
glueman 11 Feb 10 - 11:34 AM
Dave the Gnome 11 Feb 10 - 11:24 AM
Folkiedave 11 Feb 10 - 11:22 AM
Folkiedave 11 Feb 10 - 11:21 AM
GUEST,Peter Laban 11 Feb 10 - 11:20 AM
Flashmeister 11 Feb 10 - 11:08 AM
Dave the Gnome 11 Feb 10 - 10:39 AM
Flashmeister 11 Feb 10 - 10:21 AM
The Borchester Echo 11 Feb 10 - 09:04 AM
Dave the Gnome 11 Feb 10 - 08:53 AM
Folkiedave 11 Feb 10 - 08:39 AM
Lizzie Cornish 1 11 Feb 10 - 08:27 AM
GUEST,Ralphie 11 Feb 10 - 07:27 AM
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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: BB
Date: 12 Feb 10 - 02:50 PM

Ruth Archer said, "the attention would only encourage you". So why do you all do it?


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Feb 10 - 09:16 AM

Sorry Dave - You are quite right of course. It was a wish rather than assertion and I would like to make it clear that I am not encouraging any such actions from any person, living or imagined:-)

D.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 12 Feb 10 - 08:33 AM

SOH apparently owe all their success to Lizzie Cornish, I'm surprised they haven't put her on the payroll.

Dave H


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Folkiedave
Date: 12 Feb 10 - 08:12 AM

She could be doing the same for real!

What evidence do you have that she doesn't? Come on Dave, that is a simple assertion you have absolutely no evidence for whatsoever.

I am surprised at you Dave.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Feb 10 - 03:48 AM

With clogs on, Flashmeister:-) But it was not really with what you may think! I thought I had just figured out the rules of this game but they were changed again. It is no longer anything that Lizzie says = humour; anything that anyone else says = lying bollocks. I think I have got it again now though.

This thread has stayed remarkably unmoderated and I now believe it is a concious decision. While all the bollocks is going on here, the rest of the world is safe from the ravages of the mad person. It seems to be working to a certain extent so let's keep it up. I have also spotted that 'winning' seems to be important to some, sad as it is, so let them have their deluded 'victories' if it makes them happy, while the rest of us get on with real life. Think of it as care in the community.

It's a pity that good performers have to take this type of nonsense but at least any remotely sane person can see what is going on. And it could be worse. She could be doing the same for real!

Cheers

DeG


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: GUEST,Captain Jack Sparrow
Date: 12 Feb 10 - 02:45 AM

Monty Python Argument Sketch

I love these moments. I like to wave at them as they pass by.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Jack Campin
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 08:56 PM

Phil Beer:
I can handle any form of abuse, misconception, or downright vitriol. What I do NOT wish to be portrayed as is a member of some form of geriatric Boy Band.

I haven't met Phil but I'd like to.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignor
From: Flashmeister
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 08:21 PM

Flashy (working that diminutive there) she say - people here and now don't find it hilarious. I neither know nor give a tuppenny fuck about 'what went went before' but DO find the mad rants beyond tiresome and you do bloody well goad these people on here Lizzie, to the scary point where a poor musician is driven to write a plea for you to stop! that is going-through-peoples-bins scary.
blah.

Spleen Cringe - sorry my old china, there appears to have been set off a whole wrenching, twisting flurry of spleen venting round these parts. there is an ointment you can get for it though :-D

David at 0346 - that truly was your last nerve being tap danced upon - nay morris danced upon!!

Sod it, I am becoming as unhinged as LC - over and out on this - off to drink more gin until I am blind so can no longer read the rantings of the mad Mrs.Rochester escaped from her attic and kick the proverbial cat.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 06:47 PM


It matters not how many times I have to read 'Phil said THIS about YOU!" or "Steve said THAT!"


Clearly not. What you refuse to understand is that Beer & Knightley just want you to SHUT UP. What they don't mind is criticism as long as it is informed and music-based. They understand that many (myself among them) far prefer some of their other projects to SoH which continues to strike me as over-produced and a tad bombastic. For this reason I have never seen a SoH set but wish them well and hope they make a living. I've never even met Steve K and have encountered Mr Beer only vaguely at a workshop. Thus, I neither "love" nor "hate" them but have come to admire them as people for enduring so bravely all the shit that MLC hurls their way. Do grow up, fuck off and LEARN SOMETHING before spouting any more drivel.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 06:25 PM

Nope...Paco cleary stated WHY he found the music of Show of Hands, and I've put that statement above.

He then stated later on that he didn't like folk singers being political...and I took issue with him over that, in the other thread.

Checkmate is when you've outsmarted your opponent/s...and won.

I was taught chess by a man who started every single game without the Queen, because such was his skill of planning and anticipation, no-one could beat him.

It matters not how many times I have to read 'Phil said THIS about YOU!" or "Steve said THAT!"....nor 'They think you're as unpleasant as I do!".....

What matters is that I KNOW I have brought people into their music and that's what it has all been about and why you have sought to get my voice silenced, because back then, you loathed them.

Now, you all love 'em, which is GREAT!   

I pass my baton to you all.......


Checkmate, mates.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 06:08 PM

Is there a move *beyond* checkmate?

Checkmate is not a "move" but a position you find yourself in when you have made no many errors it is impossible to move any further. You constantly bleat that "messages need to be got out" because somebody or other has "hidden them away", and, furthermore, (according to you) it "wasn't like this before. Mr / Ms O'Barmy states quite adamantly that a songwriter is not a particularly good source of politics. Indeed not, it can only be a starting point. One from which you lag far behind. Checkmate is where you are now. There is only one path out of the hole you are in. Will you take it?


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Folkiedave
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 06:06 PM

I think that's called 'checkmate', but I could be wrong.

You are wrong.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 06:05 PM

No, the Boysies were the Morris Dancing Boysies, Ralph...get it right.

If you look at the seven pages of this thread, you'll see there's not ONE girly reference to Steve and Phil...only serious reference to their song.

I'm not a musician, Ralph. I've said that a thousand times..and if you only have respect for musicians, well...you're missing out on an awful lot of other folks.

And nope, the venting my spleen has brought in loads of folks..not all of whom are musicians, for there is a world beyond, you know..

In fact, if more people jumped up and down, ranted, raged and raved, then maybe we'd not be living in the Age of AIG at all.

Now there's a thought....

I'm off to listen to Ron Bankley's new song again, so if you'll excuse me........


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 05:59 PM

Lizzie.
Multiple cut and pastes do not change anything one jot.
I will start to respect you, when you learn how to sing, or play an instrument.
It's patently obvious that you don't intend to do this.
It's a bit sad really. All this energy venting your spleen on messageboards, when you could have been learning to play the fiddle.
Because thats what all of your "boysies" have spent many years doing.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 05:55 PM

"Your point being?"

My point being that 'Paco' got into their music because of reading threads like these...which proves that these threads ARE of importance, because, just like the ones I started about your music, they help to sell the artists CDs and gain them followers.

"Is there a move *beyond* checkmate?" she asked, innocently...


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 05:51 PM

"hiya Lizzie,
            It's thanks TO YOU that we got into Show of Hands!!! You got such a slagging on a thread a few years back about SOH, that I just had to hear what all the fuss was about!! So I popped out one lunchtime and bought 'Country Life' We loved it , and have followed them ever since!"


I think that's called 'checkmate', but I could be wrong. ;0)


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 05:51 PM

Oh really? Here's one MLC forgot.

Mr / Ms O'Barmy also wrote this:

From: Paco O'Barmy - PM
Date: 07 Dec 09 - 11:52 AM

I like Show of Hands... have about ten of their CD's... seen them umpteen times. But this is where I differ from the F#lk world, I would no more take my politics from a singer than I would from my milkman!!! I won't be buying this particular CD of their's. Sorry chaps.


Oddly, the bizarreness of the punctuation strongly resembles that of the OP.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 05:50 PM

Lizzie.....Errrrmmm?
Your point being?
When did any musician want to be popular?
Musicians make music. thats what they do.
If they get lucky, maybe they'll make a few shillings. (Not me sadly)
Trying to turn traditional music into some sort of quasi X Factor, is quite frankly nauseating.
"Popular in the English Folk World"
That to me means, You get 30 people in a dingy upstairs room in a pub, having driven 400 miles for 50 quid.
Thats a pretty good gig to me.
All your boysies, are in the main, damn well destitute. and play music because that is what they do. It's bad enough earning less than the minimum wage per annum (However talented they may be), But to then be subjected to fawning idolatry by someone who doesn't even want to buy their product, and expects to be given it for nothing. Is just downright insulting.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 05:39 PM

Arrogance, Ignorance & Greed
From: GUEST,Fagan family - PM
Date: 03 Dec 09 - 09:42 AM

We love it and think it is their best so far.

Thank you Lizzie for starting this thread >>>



Arrogance, Ignorance & Greed
From: Dave Roberts - PM
Date: 03 Dec 09 - 01:04 PM

Coming back to Show Of Hands, I just watched/listened to the video.

It's brilliant - a protest song in the good, old-fashioned, worthwhile sense.

SoH have played Middlewich several times, and were never less than fabulous.<<<<


RE: Arrogance, Ignorance & Greed (Show of Hands CD)
From: theleveller - PM
Date: 08 Dec 09 - 03:43 AM

What I've always loved about Show of Hands is that they are never afraid to embrace the issues that matter, be it illegal wars, greedy bankers or the decimation of the countryside by those same selfish bastards and their like buying up the housing stock for second homes. This is in the true spirit of folk music. Yes, this CD will certainly be top of my Christmas list. <<<<



There ya go! Some decent messages from the previous thread, which you can find at the top of this page, link Number 1


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 05:33 PM

Good to see that you agree with Paco, too, David.

(silvery smiley) :0)


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 05:32 PM

Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: GUEST,Ralphie - PM
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 05:16 PM

I'm beginning to be in one accord with Mr/s O'Barmy.


That's excellent then....because in the previous thread about this CD, which was far nicer than this thread..with far more positive postings about..er..music, he said this, Ralph...


Arrogance, Ignorance & Greed (Show of Hands CD)
From: Paco O'Barmy - PM
Date: 11 Dec 09 - 02:38 PM

hiya Lizzie,
            It's thanks TO YOU that we got into Show of Hands!!! You got such a slagging on a thread a few years back about SOH, that I just had to hear what all the fuss was about!! So I popped out one lunchtime and bought 'Country Life' We loved it , and have followed them ever since!
            re: political folk, yes I understand.But we have all got the vote now, (even women) so, to my mind, the purpose of the Folk Singer has been acheived. Therefore they are now redundant, and should move aside for the next ( fully enfranchised ) generation. <<<


Well, well, well......


Sux years of publicity never did Show of Hands any harm at all. There is no such thing as bad publicity, only bad 'mates' who make yer life hell 'cos their eaten up with jealousy that your more popular than they are...

And of course, let's all shoot ANYONE who DARES to be 'popular' in the English folk world, rather than 'the same' 'equal' and 'non-descript'


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 05:20 PM

It's because of threads like this that, a few years back, I stopped taking mudcat seriously as a music site.

You know, Paco. I wish I would have thought of that. I always thought it was a serious site for people that love folk an blues music. Well, you live and learn...

:D

(Where is that silvery smiley when you need it?)


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 05:16 PM

I'm beginning to be in one accord with Mr/s O'Barmy.
Yes. lizzie is bonkers. But, she's clever enough to know how to press the right buttons. Just as that bloke WAV does on his extremely strange Walkabouts thread.
Like you Paco. I come here to seek information. Musical, Technical, whatever. And, by and large that is what I find. It's a valuable resource.
Sadly, I'm only human, and when she attacks friends, I react.(Not nice or clever, I know, Mea Culpa)
But I react.
I even try and be helpful, as I've said before, I actually agree with a lot of her sentiments, but, why preach to the already converted?
Go and fight the opposition in the real world. not here in cyberspace.
Stand for election...Theres still time before May!
Lizzie and WAV would make a dream team!


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Paco O'Barmy
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 05:02 PM

I think there is a lot in that last post Mr Glueperson.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: GUEST,glueperson googling
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 05:00 PM

Mudcat is a case of bright enough to bitch, not smart enough to let it lie.
Too many modestly sized fish in tiny ponds all thinking they're sharks instead of sticklebacks.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Paco O'Barmy
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 04:52 PM

It's because of threads like this that, a few years back, I stopped taking mudcat seriously as a music site.Now I tend to just make nonsensical or contraversial posts in the BS sections. Mudcat has long been an unmoderated bear pit. My musical compadres would be appalled to learn that I even looked in here. What a shame.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Folkiedave
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 04:39 PM

Lizzie was just shite scared 'cos some bloke she met on the internet had just realised she was barking mad and dumped her.

Really? People meet on the internet? That's amazing. I didn't know that happened. That's a real piece of Lizziana.

I must save that.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 04:07 PM

"I find it very odd and kinda disturbing that EVEN at the Folk Awards, you were...apparently, carrying on your er..carrying on about me."

Well, actually it was Steve who brought it up to me. He mentioned that he had observed your most recent antics on this thread, and we had a bit of a laugh, and both agreed that you are utterly barking. Though when I suggested he might be the mischievous Taddylad he was very clear that he's lurked, but not posted.

Phil seemed genuinely dismayed at your persistence, actually. I think (it was rather late at this stage, and a few light ales may have been taken) he even suggested he might have to send you another message, but I'm pretty sure I said that the attention would only encourage you.

If I have misremembered the gist of this conversation at all, Mr Beer and /or Mr Knightley are very welcome to correct me.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 03:46 PM

I can't do it any more. I have tried my best to avoid personal attacks but I can only say it one way. You really are a fucking nutter. Not in a nice way like the old bloke on the bus. In a nasty malicious vindictive way. Hannibal Lector has nothing on you.

May be deleted but I hope you read it first.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 03:42 PM

"But because poor, beleaguered Phil Beer told me at the folk awards he was very happy to have her reminded of what he said to her a few months ago, here it is again for those who may have missed it. You'll note what he actually said was quite different to Lizzie's version of it, but maybe she needs reminding again:"

Er...methinks you can get into trouble for constantly posting the same thing, over and over and over. That must be about ooooooo the 356th time you've posted that now. Yawn....

I find it very odd and kinda disturbing that EVEN at the Folk Awards, you were...apparently, carrying on your er..carrying on about me.

???????????????

You know, you really are getting more than a little obsessive, Joan...and of course, winding poor Phil up ever more..Nooooo, you wouldn't be doing it for that reason,now, would you?

Madame Intelligensia is a *very* scarybaby... LOL

You know, the one thing I always liked about Phil was his sense of humour....Maybe he's Madame Intelligensia has turned him into a Stepford Fiddle Player? YIKES! She must have slipped some dark potion into his drink...I have to rescue him from a life of slavery!
(I'm about to fall off my chair with giggles here) :0)


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 03:36 PM

Look, Phil was just shite scared 'cos Madame Intelligensia had snoggyboggyed him at a gig and he'd been told she was me, as I patiently explained before..Thus, he rushed to his computer to BEG me to leave him alone...horrified at the thought!

Humour?

Look, Lizzie was just shite scared 'cos some bloke she met on the internet had just realised she was barking mad and dumped her. We patiently explined that she was indeed three people short of a duo but she rushed to the computer to swear and rant at people who had fuck all to do with anything to leave her alone.

Still humour?

Must be because I am pissing down my trouser leg as I write it...

DeG


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 03:32 PM

Oh poo....you're just miffed at those photos. :0)

And now, back to SoH...


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 03:28 PM

Ah, so you want to talk about the Albion Band now? The OP started this thread off complaining about SoH's vid so I really think you ought to ask him before changing it so radically, or even demanding its closure. Though, of course, you don't HAVE to read it, nor say anything at all . . .

Your "informant" is, however, sadly adrift. The Albion Band was formed as a loose conglomeration of musicians to back Shirley Collins on No Roses during the recording in the Island Studios in 1972. I still have my white label. Then a core band comprising Simon Nicol, Steve Ashley, Sue Draheim, Dave Mattacks and Ashley Hutchings toured. Just because your amateur snapper took these shots in 1974 does this line-up (it's hard to decipher who is in it) suddenly become "original". The Albion Band had, after all, even more line-ups than Hedgehog Pie.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 03:14 PM

Poor, poor Lizzie the Victim. Of course, she never, ever makes snidey sideswipes at people to provoke them in to responding to her, and then cries foul when they do...that would never, EVER happen.

But because poor, beleaguered Phil Beer told me at the folk awards he was very happy to have her reminded of what he said to her a few months ago, here it is again for those who may have missed it. You'll note what he actually said was quite different to Lizzie's version of it, but maybe she needs reminding again:


"Ok Enough now!!

I pass through these boards once every couple of weeks but simply don't have time to peruse them regularly. I'm too busy gigging or recording and they are my priorities in life. I'm far more concerned with doing it than talking about it. Please forgive me posting this in one thread when it is relevant to several, and indeed to other boards as well. (Please feel free to cut and paste, anyone who chooses to!) The last bit of this piece is completely relevent to the thread.

LC. I don't know who you are, only that you are from my patch and seem to have seen us rather more times than is, perhaps, healthy. Maybe I spoke to you even on the last two local shows . I don't know. I understand that you mean well and that you feel you are championing some sort of cause on our (and indeed others) behalfs. Let me explain a bit about this internet place. Its not a universal fanzine. Its a genre specific place of chat and discussion for a bunch of folks, many of whom have a great deal of knowledge and indeed expertise in their subject. I know many of them as both friends and acquaintances. My band makes music that has one of its (Possibly cloven) hooves in this place and the other three 'Out There' in the rest of the world. Many of the folks here consider themselves as (self appointed) guardians of something rare and precious. I have ABSOLUTELY no problem with this. All I ask is that they maintain visiting hours so that I can get on with building the new wing (Crap metaphor, sorry!) whilst having access to the edifice. (Also a self appointed task) Virtually everyone contributing here decided whether they liked/disliked our music more than 15 years ago. Our task is as always to bring the music to a wider audience and whether or not anyone here likes or dislikes us is not relevant.

What is important now is that I must try and make you understand the difference between things like, say, the Folk Awards, the Mercury Prize and the EFDSS badge. They serve their purposes in order to obtain a degree of status in the world at large. They give us something to say about ourselves in press releases and are sometimes good for the personal ego. Thats all.

When Ian A pushed for the EFDSS badge for Walter Pardon, it was an entirely and utterly different ball game. The EFDSS at that juncture was internally and politically in a very odd place in which song took a very poor back seat to dance ( Hence---DEAFASS the Dance Earnestly And Forget About Song Society) I never bothered with the Sidmouth festival in my younger days because it was 90% dance oriented.

This small but significant internal award to Walter was actually very very important in terms of getting the powers to recognise that here was a person of great stature and importance as a real, living, singing, purveyor of traditional song. None of us can ever be that. At best, if we're very lucky, some of what we do may pass into the song line. It would be good to think so, however, nothing that we do can possibly be compared to what Walter actually WAS (To quote SK).

Please Lizzie. I'm delighted that you like our music. We are absolutely clear about who we are, what we are doing, and where its going. I just turned 56 last week. I still have the will and the energy and the best is yet to come. I can handle any form of abuse, misconception, or downright vitriol. What I do NOT wish to be portrayed as is a member of some form of geriatric Boy Band. This sort of adulation is utterly embarrassing and I'd really like it to stop now.

Sorry to take up everyone elses time. I'm delighted that the EFDSS is in the shape its in now. It bodes well for the future. We are not just passing through, we are taking it with us. Keep the doors open and the pages turning!!!

Phil (Should be in the studio) Beer"


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 02:30 PM

Diane, first of all, you don't have to open this thread, nor read anything I write...but you'd be lost without your Sidmouth Seagull, so go on wich yer! ((xx))

Flashy...actually, for your information, LOADS of people thought we were an absolute hoot. Hell, I even got a 'live' messageboard going on the BBC every single Monday evening, when we'd all tune in to Folkwaves and fall over sideways with laughter...apart from er...Sweetums, bless her cotton socks, but she loves to be the Anti-Giggle, so that's OK.

Best not to advise me on things you weren't a part of back then..

Look, Phil was just shite scared 'cos Madame Intelligensia had snoggyboggyed him at a gig and he'd been told she was me, as I patiently explained before..Thus, he rushed to his computer to BEG me to leave him alone...horrified at the thought!

(I'm writing this with a big grin on my face, for the Humourless Ones, btw)

"We don't think you're funny, Lizzie!"

Tough... ;0)







AND.....on the previous page I told you how a chappie came over to ask Sam whether he'd like to use some of his photos on The Albion Chronicles, but...I couldn't find them. Well, here they are...some very early photos of The Albion Dance Band...

Just click on 'Photographs' to see the whole lot.....

The Albion Dance Band - Albion Chronicles


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: GUEST,Spleen Cringe
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 12:33 PM

Flashmeister: "spleen venting"

Oi, Flash! Ow! OW! That hurt...


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Folkiedave
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 12:18 PM

they are not crazed fanzines

I liked Mudcat. There was an amazing amount of information and knowledge on here and you could reckon a lot of the information was totally accurate. Malcolm Douglas (RIP) made nearly 9,000 erudite and highly accurate posts (generally speaking). I used to love reading his words - even though I could and occasionally did nip round to his house.

Others have been equally kind and helpful to the Mudcat Community. So people mention their favourite artists and some post links.

Now of course it has become "Mudcat Care in the Community"


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: glueman
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 11:34 AM

"Music fora are for exchanging information; they are not crazed fanzines"

If only that were true. Show me an upholder of the tradition and I'll show you a fan with good PR. What is the folk revival if not a fan forum?

Lizzie's is just an extreme version of a common malaise, you see her in yourselves which is why she scares you. I wouldn't open my curtains if SoH played in the garden but that's because I don't like middle aged men shouting polemic on subjects I can make my own mind up about, ta. I'm sure they are better than competent musicians, support the folk community and donate to their local cat's home. People need to remember their opinions have no objective reality, for or against.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 11:24 AM

Course we have homes to go to - But I am at work at the moment. What do you expect me to do? Work???

:D


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Folkiedave
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 11:22 AM

And frankly Peter I rarely make comments on guests postings.

But you stole my 300 there!


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Folkiedave
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 11:21 AM

Here is a link to my mate Mike's guitar and workshop website.

Loads of good stuff about guitar tunings.

Discuss.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: GUEST,Peter Laban
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 11:20 AM

3 feckin hundred. Have ye no homes to go to?


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Flashmeister
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 11:08 AM

Indeed, my partner has played in DGDGAD so long he no longer knows how to do standard tuning - he says it makes his beloved old Fylde scream :-D


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 10:39 AM

Hi Ms Flash - I discoverd, no more than 5 years ago, that when I learned to play guitar from my Dad about 40 years ago I learned in DGDGBD. Only ever played one tune in that but I have managed to remeber and ressurect it recently:-) Did learn in EADGBE as well but as I never practice anything I never became any good:-( I still like Open G though:-)

DeG


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Flashmeister
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 10:21 AM

Lizzie, sadly no-one else finds the things written 'hilarious' nor do I detect one little gasp of genuine joviality in your exchanges with Borchester Echo let alone wit - it just appears to me that you antagonise her.
To echo the above sentiments the vast majority of people come here to impart and glean information not be hysterically preached at and as Ralphie said people do broadly agree with the more lucid and sensible things you say, myself included, just disagree with the manner in which you say it and react to people.

sad guitarists going on about guitar tunings is far more enlightening and worthwhile than the narcissistic ranting and spleen venting of a clearly troubled mind daubed all over the thread.

...i quite like CGCDGA ;-D


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 09:04 AM

Diane and I have been joking

I am not joking. Nor was Phil Beer. Nor Eliza Carthy. Nor many others who don't (yet) say what they think about the embarrassment they suffer from MLC's destructive drivel so very publicly. Music fora are for exchanging information; they are not crazed fanzines. I come here to seek and to impart information on songs and tunes, not to see distasteful crap about "boysies". In recent days I have added details about music in Hampstead in the 60s and clarified the origin of a tune used for a Child ballad that a contributor thought had been written by a band currently doing it. MLC isn't interested in this but many others are. OK, she could flutter away on the Devon breeze and seek out media reports of B Bragg's anti-RBS campaign which she says (unsurprisingly) that she has no knowledge of. Last year on May Day, BB, Leon Rosselson, Robb Johnson and Martin Carthy were performing for free and a load of trade union activists were speaking at a commemoration of the Tolpuddle Martyrs. Don't suppose she's heard of them either. She certainly wasn't supporting the event. Pity, since they provided a perfect example of the way to go.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 08:53 AM

Diane wears Show of Hands knickers = humour

Lizzie wrote a whole page about me on Myspace = a load of utter, lying bullshit.


Sorry. Can't see the difference myself. Never say I am not willing to learn though so if Diane can confirm that the 'history; between you is all in good fun and Folkiedave confirms that his comments about you are part of some incidious plot against you then I will stand corrected.

Oh, and in case you had not noticed, the thread was not actualy about Show of Hands, but about their latest video. Which I have now seen and must say I have seen and heard better. Pretty good but I will not be spending any hard earned on it. Sorry guys but I am sure you can do withoout me - Son number 1 is a big fan and makes up for it anyway:-)

Cheers

DeG


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Folkiedave
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 08:39 AM

Show of Hands. Great band, marvellous fan-base. Pack out most halls. Great song-writers and terrific instrumentalists. From what I understand from those who have met them, terrific blokes. Do a lot for folk music in their area.

As I understand it Phil has publicly posted that he wants Lizzie to shut up.

There you are Lizzie, discussion of Show of Hands.


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 08:27 AM

"Lizzie is just not playing the game. Making it about her, if she wants to get back to a show of hands discussion she should SHUT UP"


I have asked, over and over that it becomes about Show of Hands..I have left postings to come on here..and guess what, they're filled with lies and vitriol about me. So, I ask again...for people to talk about the subject of this thread..

Now, thank God, it seems they are, apart from the usual few and perhaps 'Mad Spaniel' you should ask those people to stop bringing my name into things. Thanks.

David, for your information, because you are not aware of how long Diane and I have been joking towards one another, that was humour. You have to understand the history behind this whole thing, and that goes back to the BBC board, where Diane and I would write hilarious things about each other as well as lose it completely. Probably best to leave that part to us....as I can assure you that Diane will understand my words there...(and cue Sweetums rage...!) ;0)

"This thread should be about Show of hands. Fan or not you have to admire their balls though I also think some of the images in the video are CGI'd. Be interesting to know if they are or not?"

THANK YOU!!!! At LONG last someone has got the message!

This thread is.......about......Show of Hands!!



Onward and Upward..


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Subject: RE: Show Of Hands - over the top?-Arrogance, Ignorance
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 11 Feb 10 - 07:27 AM

Oh Lizzie...
We're not against you, far from it. But the way you react to most posters on here, is childish.
SoH are a good band (not Duo!) agreed.
Oyster Band are good too. As were Fiddlers Dram before them.
Billy Bragg is a major champion for the oppressed in this country.
As is Leon Rosselson, Dick Gaughan, and hundreds of other musicians..Pete Morton, Pete Coe, Jez Lowe, etc.
If you want to change the world, form your own political party, write songs, get on you're soapbox (Just like Mr Bragg has done), put your money where your mouth is...We will all applaud. Good on yer girl.
What we, on this forum, and others do not need is to have hysterical rants from you.
You're on the wrong message board here.

Most of us have been there, done the marches, fought the good fight, etc. (I was a bit young for Jarrow and Aldermaston I admit!)

So, why are you shouting at us? In the broadest sense, we all agree with a lot of what you say. We are not the problem. The establishment is the problem...Go and have a go at them, and leave us sad guitar players to discuss tunings....


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