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Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing

GUEST,Bruce Michael Baillie 19 Jun 07 - 06:51 AM
Steve Shaw 19 Jun 07 - 07:00 AM
Edmond 19 Jun 07 - 07:01 AM
GUEST 19 Jun 07 - 07:30 AM
GUEST 19 Jun 07 - 07:50 AM
Richard Bridge 19 Jun 07 - 08:18 AM
KeithofChester 19 Jun 07 - 08:44 AM
Sugwash 19 Jun 07 - 09:15 AM
concertina ceol 19 Jun 07 - 09:25 AM
Dave Hanson 19 Jun 07 - 09:27 AM
KeithofChester 19 Jun 07 - 09:45 AM
KeithofChester 19 Jun 07 - 09:51 AM
Richard Bridge 19 Jun 07 - 09:51 AM
GUEST,DocJohn 19 Jun 07 - 10:03 AM
Peter T. 19 Jun 07 - 10:11 AM
redsnapper 19 Jun 07 - 10:20 AM
George Papavgeris 19 Jun 07 - 10:24 AM
Amos 19 Jun 07 - 10:30 AM
Desdemona 19 Jun 07 - 10:40 AM
Big Phil 19 Jun 07 - 10:45 AM
John Hardly 19 Jun 07 - 10:46 AM
jonm 19 Jun 07 - 10:46 AM
Metchosin 19 Jun 07 - 11:04 AM
KeithofChester 19 Jun 07 - 11:18 AM
concertina ceol 19 Jun 07 - 11:29 AM
McGrath of Harlow 19 Jun 07 - 01:09 PM
breezy 19 Jun 07 - 01:50 PM
Cathie 19 Jun 07 - 02:05 PM
GUEST,Big Mick 19 Jun 07 - 02:36 PM
Doug Chadwick 20 Jun 07 - 02:56 AM
GUEST,Brian Peters 20 Jun 07 - 07:02 AM
GUEST 20 Jun 07 - 10:47 AM
GUEST,Johnmc 20 Jun 07 - 04:12 PM
George Papavgeris 20 Jun 07 - 06:55 PM
cshurtz 20 Jun 07 - 11:38 PM
TRUBRIT 20 Jun 07 - 11:46 PM
Don(Wyziwyg)T 21 Jun 07 - 08:38 AM
GUEST,meself 21 Jun 07 - 09:15 AM
Don(Wyziwyg)T 21 Jun 07 - 09:28 AM
Richard Bridge 21 Jun 07 - 09:31 AM
GUEST,meself 21 Jun 07 - 09:39 AM
GUEST,meself 21 Jun 07 - 09:52 AM
GUEST,meself 21 Jun 07 - 09:57 AM
GUEST,QM 21 Jun 07 - 11:19 AM
McGrath of Harlow 21 Jun 07 - 08:38 PM
Trevor 22 Jun 07 - 07:45 AM
SINSULL 22 Jun 07 - 09:15 AM
RamblinStu 22 Jun 07 - 10:28 AM
McGrath of Harlow 22 Jun 07 - 05:50 PM
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Subject: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: GUEST,Bruce Michael Baillie
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 06:51 AM

So, what do you lot out there think of Paul McCartneys mandolin playing skills? Lets be knowing!


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 07:00 AM

Er...you do realise that you put "Paul McCartney" and "skills" in the same sentence, do you? ;-)


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: Edmond
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 07:01 AM

Paul who ?


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 07:30 AM

Dear Brucie..prefer his mandolin skills to your grammar usage!


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 07:50 AM

I play mandolin in a very similar way to Sir Paul, and after I'd used mandolin in the intro to one of my songs at a gig on Saturday, someone came up and asked if I taught the mandolin.
"Teach it? I barely play it!" was my answer.
So I suppose that must apply to Sir Paul too.
Cheers
Dave


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 08:18 AM

Where might I hear these wonders?


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: KeithofChester
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 08:44 AM

For those that have been elsewhere, the song in question has been all over BBC Radio and TV, and the album was number 5 in the charts. However it is also on YouTube

Dance Tonight

Ironically an old George Harrison album is now Number 1, but George is helped out by Bob Dylan, Roy Orbison, Tom Petty, Jeff Lynne and Jim Kelner on it. It'll give George ammunition for demanding at least 2 of his songs be included on the first Beatles celestial effort.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: Sugwash
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 09:15 AM

I much preferred George Harrison's ukulele playing to Paul's mandolin playing which, ironically, he is playing more like a ukulele than a mandolin.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: concertina ceol
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 09:25 AM

Don't go knocking the Travelling Wilburys now - that would be cheap as two of 'em are dead. Great "fun" music.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 09:27 AM

Chris Thile, Simon Mayor and David Grisman had better watch out.

eric


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: KeithofChester
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 09:45 AM

Don't go knocking the Travelling Wilburys now - that would be cheap as two of 'em are dead. Great "fun" music.

I wasn't knocking. I was being ironic. I bought that great Travelling Wilburys album the day it came out, despite having both the original disks. It was worth it for the DVD alone. I haven't yet done a comparative listening on the new mix and remaster vs the old. The McCartney album is pretty good, but the new Travelling Wilburys Collection is better. Indeed it is better than most current CDs, and the chart position reflects that.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: KeithofChester
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 09:51 AM

Talking of Ukuleles, George Harrison, Macca, Ringo plus with a little bit of help from Eric Clapton, various Wilburys and other friends.

Something


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 09:51 AM

Well, McCartney is not too clever, bland, and inoffensive. About par for the course really.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: GUEST,DocJohn
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 10:03 AM

Singer, guitarist, symphony composer, poet, artist, photographer ... and now mandolin player (?) Is there no limit to this man's talent!? Move over Hugo Dalton & Bill Monroe.

DocJohn


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: Peter T.
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 10:11 AM

And a truly dreary song.......

yours,

Peter T.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: redsnapper
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 10:20 AM

As someone said... Hugo D'Alton and Chris Thile move aside!!!

Don't give up the day job Paul.

RS


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 10:24 AM

The lyrics are a jumble of cliches, the tune inoffensive as Richard says, it will be forgotten a year from now, but it's written by Macca so it has all the makings of a hit number.

Shame. He is the first songwriter I admired, in my early teens, and he has written several cracking songs. He doesn't need the money, and he should know better - so why did he let that one out of the door?


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: Amos
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 10:30 AM

IT is awesome to me to see this man in his late 60's, yes?, performing "I Saw Her Standing There" -- after all these years of endless repetitions -- and still injecting it with verve and excitement. Hat's off to Paul.


A


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: Desdemona
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 10:40 AM

Gee, Paul, thanks for the update; apparently everyone having to wang chung tonight is a thing of the past!

I'm with George P on this one. Paul McCartney (along with John Lennon) was amongst the great songwriters of the 20th century, which is the only reason anyone pays any attention to the innocuous pap he's been churning out these past 30 years.

~D


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: Big Phil
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 10:45 AM

He is just "Strumming", not playing the instrument.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: John Hardly
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 10:46 AM

After all, what is music if not a contest of skills?


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: jonm
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 10:46 AM

Interviewed on Jools Holland's show, he said he had bought the mandolin in November because it was the only left-handed instrument in a shop he visited. Self-taught with the aid of a chord book.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: Metchosin
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 11:04 AM

Maybe if Paul played mandolin more like Jake plays ukelele it would help.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: KeithofChester
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 11:18 AM

Maybe if Paul played mandolin more like Jake plays ukelele it would help.

That is a brilliant clip!


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: concertina ceol
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 11:29 AM

Keith of Chester I was being tongue in cheek as well - I'm doing well at causing "cross" posting today......


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 01:09 PM

I echo John Hardly's ironic comment: "After all, what is music if not a contest of skills?"


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: breezy
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 01:50 PM

There are only a few chords and then they only require 2 fingers

Nah , he cant be that clever!!

There may be a rush on mandos in the music shops

mine is for sale . plus hard case, Antoria, flat back, 30 years old , mint condition, wife can stand the sound

500


Well who knows what the Macca effect will have !!


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: Cathie
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 02:05 PM

Breezy -
You do mean wife can stand the sound, yeah?
That's good news, 'cos Paul is going to marry me next.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: GUEST,Big Mick
Date: 19 Jun 07 - 02:36 PM

Why take the piss? Here is a man who could rest on his laurels, do nothing, and live nicely the rest of his years. Instead he is still trying to relate to fans and create music. As George points out, it isn't his best or even close. But he is still swinging......

Mic


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 20 Jun 07 - 02:56 AM

I know someone who plays a mean version of "Jealousy" on the mandolin. So do lots of others, it would appear.

DC


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: GUEST,Brian Peters
Date: 20 Jun 07 - 07:02 AM

"He is just "Strumming", not playing the instrument."

Who said "strumming" is not "playing"? Did Lonnie Donegan not "play" guitar? This assumes that there is one 'correct' way of playing the instrument - which, given the variety of styles in some of the examples mentioned above, is clearly untrue. Whether or not you like Sir P's song, he has chosen to use the mandolin to give a different texture from that which would be provided by a guitar or, for that matter, a ukelele. McGuinness - Flint did something very similar years ago on When I'm Dead and Gone, and on the "Songlinks" CD Tim Eriksen accompanies Still Growing with a very basic strum on "a cheap mandolin with a strip of paper woven between the strings" - and very effective it is too. Song accompaniment is not the same as virtuoso musicianship.

Incidentally Paul sounds to be playing his 'D' chord with a G drone at the bottom of it, which is a more interesting sound than just playing the chords from the manual. And if I'm not mistaken he's tuned the instrument down a tone as well.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Jun 07 - 10:47 AM

Strumming isn't playing now then? Bugger. Pete Townshend, Dick Gaughan, Harvey Andrews, Bob Dylan, Donal Lunny, me, and probably lots of people on this board have all been wasting our time then?
    Please note that anonymous posting is no longer allowed at Mudcat. Use a consistent name [in the 'from' box] when you post, or your messages risk being deleted.
    Thanks.
    -Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: GUEST,Johnmc
Date: 20 Jun 07 - 04:12 PM

I believe the striking thing about Macca and the rest is that, without being virtuosos,
they managed to use instruments in a way which brought out their inherent strengths (the instruments', I mean).
   Most would cite" Martha my dear"," Blackbird", harpsichord on "We can work it out",
"The end' for electric etc.
   In other words, Macca is a composer before he is an instrumentalist.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 20 Jun 07 - 06:55 PM

Very good point, GUEST,Johnmc


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: cshurtz
Date: 20 Jun 07 - 11:38 PM

"He is just "Strumming", not playing the instrument."

Where would music be without strumming? You know what I hate the most-- is those assholes that are constantly trying to show off their little licks. They tend to have no creative abilities and are just a pain to try to play with. A mandolin (as any string instrument) sounds good strummed: it also sounds good played other ways. I have learned an array of picking styles on several instruments, but sometime I just like to strum some chords. I am secure enough as a musician to do so, and I guess Paul is too. Stop your bitching :)


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: TRUBRIT
Date: 20 Jun 07 - 11:46 PM

I'm with Amos --it is amazing that Sir P.can still inject enthusiasm into some of those songs he has been playing for years. He isn't perfect but I think he and J, R, and G have made a contribution to music in the last 50 years that really can't be ignored or demeaned (or shouldn't be).........


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 21 Jun 07 - 08:38 AM

Sometimes, folks, less is more.

Virtuosi (not virtuosos), are aware of that.

This is not the best of Macca for some, but I'll lay odds that it is EXACTLY what he intended it to be, and who (given the length and prominence of his career) has the right to gainsay him?

Don T.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: GUEST,meself
Date: 21 Jun 07 - 09:15 AM

For the benefit of spelling pedants, excerpts from three dictionaries:


virtuoso      /ˌvɜrtʃuˈoʊsoʊ/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[vur-choo-oh-soh] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation noun, plural -sos, -si

virtuoso       (vr'chōō-ō'sō, -zō) Pronunciation Key
n.   pl. virtuosos or virtuosi (-sē)

virtuoso [vəːtʃuˈəusəu] noun plurals ˌvirtuˈosos, ~virtuˈ


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 21 Jun 07 - 09:28 AM

Guest meself, dictionaries often give way on such issues, and I will happily endose their judgement when I hear an Italian say VIRTUOSOS.
It's HIS language we English speakers (and that loosely includes my US friends) are buggering up.

Don T.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 21 Jun 07 - 09:31 AM

Or even endorse.

But on this Don, I am with you.

Similarly the non-classicists (or dare I say "uneducated") who say "the hoi polloi". Quite ruins the effect.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: GUEST,meself
Date: 21 Jun 07 - 09:39 AM

Some of us feel that 'virtuoso' has become an English word. Yes - we have stolen it - don't tell the Italians! No disrespect to whom, but I don't care a fig how they say anything. And I don't think we're buggering up their language; I'm sure it's getting along just fine.

But then, I pronounce the 't' at the end of 'restaurant', boor that I am, so what do I know?


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: GUEST,meself
Date: 21 Jun 07 - 09:52 AM

And I certainly hope I say 'hoi polloi' in the manner that ruins the effect.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: GUEST,meself
Date: 21 Jun 07 - 09:57 AM

" ... Since the Greek phrase includes an article, some critics have argued that the phrase the hoi polloi is redundant. But phrases borrowed from other languages are often reanalyzed in English as single words. For example, a number of Arabic noun phrases were borrowed into English as simple nouns. The Arabic element al- means "the," and appears in English nouns such as alcohol and alchemy. Thus, since no one would consider a phrase such as "the alcohol" to be redundant, criticizing the hoi polloi on similar grounds seems pedantic."

From here.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: GUEST,QM
Date: 21 Jun 07 - 11:19 AM

Very interesting posting string. The only thang I question, though, is an earlier comment that Paul is first a composer before he is an instrumentalist. That might actually be on even keel, as Paul's instrument contributions to the Beatles and his solo works are generally way far overlooked. To the point that George often got credit in the public's eye for some of Paul's great Beatle guitar part contributions...ie. the Sgt. Pepper lick, the Taxman solo. Even in Paul's last two albums, the intricate musical arrangements-generally consisting at most times of his instrumentation-are possibly the highest points of the albums. The instrumentation moods he consistently struck in Chaos & Creation were absolutely awesome and other than going over the top a bit on a couple of Memory Full songs, the instrumentation and their arrangement are absolutely top notch. Perhaps, better than the song compositions themselves-which are pretty darn good.

Listen to Chaos and Creation, again for the way the songs and lyrics are often sung upbeat totally contrasted by his heavy laden instrumentation pulling the listener in two separate directions at once...basically simulating the upward/downward pull of Lennon-McCartney's musical chemistry. This is Paul doing it all himself. Quite an instrumental feat. In Memory Full, the same thing is often occurring although its more of a George Martin-Paul McCartney musical chemistry going on...with Paul's instrumentation expanding his own horizon.

Paul might really be an instrumentalist first and a composer second.

I'll admit the mandolin playing is pretty basic on the first song, but one can't help but notice that it is that basic mandolin playing that is driving Paul's vocals to a very cool level that somehow incorporates and pays tribute to country roots, skiffle roots, bluegrass roots, and George Harrison's ukelele. For a simple mandolin strum to do all that in one sweep (or strum) is quite phenomonal instrumentation in itself. I think that's what Paul meant when he said his new discovery of mandolin was responsible for driving the energy of the song or whatever it was he said.

John Lennon on the other hand was a great lyrical and rhythm composer. Paul is a great melodic and instrumentalist composer. To second rate his instrumentalist capabilities isn't accurate based on his collected works (new and old.)

QM


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 21 Jun 07 - 08:38 PM

Shorter Oxford English Dictionary (that's the two volume one with 2,672 pages - not that short) gives it as virtuosi and virtuosos both being correct. But my impression is that the word has now been anglicised to the extent that virtuosos is now more common usage.
...........................

Here's the youtube clip with the official video. Good fun stuff, not one of the great songs, but so what? Basic strumming is the right kin dof accompaniment, clever stuff would have spoiled it.

An dhere's a discussion about all this on a specialsit mandolin site.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: Trevor
Date: 22 Jun 07 - 07:45 AM

"Nah , he cant be that clever!!"
"Well, McCartney is not too clever..."


Wish I was as stupid as him!


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: SINSULL
Date: 22 Jun 07 - 09:15 AM

For those of you who missed Jake Shimabukuro on Utube, scroll up to Metchosin's post at 11:04AM. A man who definitely does not strum.


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: RamblinStu
Date: 22 Jun 07 - 10:28 AM

The fact that we even consider debating the merits of Paul McCartney is a bit rich. I enjoy my playing as much as the next man and I do the best I can, but I don't think that in thirty forty or even fifty years anyone will give a flying fig about my music. But I bet they will still be discussing the merits of Paul McCartney's.

By the way who let the line from Trubbrit

"but I think he and J, R, and G have made a contribution to music"

pass without adverse comment, what's the matter Trubbrit time too precious to write the full name...
That's more like it, petty squabbles, not criticising one of the greats


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Subject: RE: Review: Paul McCartneys Mandolin playing
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 22 Jun 07 - 05:50 PM

There are two sorts of performances.   The ones that leave people feeling amazed and knowing they could never do that and they couldn't even begin to try. And the ones that leave them feeling they'd love to do that, and that perhaps they could.

We've had two video clips so far in this thread. Jake Shimbukuro is an example of the first sort of performance. Paul McCartney is an example of the second.

There's room for both. But the second sort has a special kind of importance. When we criticise it because it's not the second sort, we are failing to recognise that importance.


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