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User Name Thread Name Subject Posted
GUEST,TIA BS: It's global warming, stupid! (303* d) RE: BS: It's global warming, stupid! 27 Jun 13

Mars: if Earth climate models, constrained by centuries of data of myriad types, are so unreliable, how can we know anything about climate on Mars based on just a few snapshots beginning in 1977? And the eccentricity of Mars' orbit is 5x Earth's, so climate fluctuations and forcing are going to be vastly different. We learn nothing from the comparison.

Jupiter: receives 4% of the solar radiation that Earth does, and has a net outward flow of energy from some deep or perhaps primordial heat source, so its "climate" forcings and fluctuations will be nothing like Earth's. Again we learn nothing from the comparison.

The "how can global warming be anthropogenic because Mars/Jupiter is warming too?" argument is an ofuscatory denialist talking point with no scientific substance. First you will need to show a sufficent time series of data to demonstrate that they are warming. Then you need to develop a model to explain why they are warming (a model that accounts for their orbital parameters, atmospheric composition, and elemental cycling between their various "spheres" (hydrosphere, geosphere, atmosphere, etc.) And note that the huge differences in these parameters and spheres between Earth, Mars and Jupiter will mean that the models will be vastly different. This is a great field for research, and it is being done. But nobody doing this research is claiming global warming on these other planets... (well except one paper back in about 1992 that compared a 1977 picture of the Martian South Pole to one taken in 1990 or so, and noted that the albedo was lower in 1990. Could have been from shrinkage of the ice cap, but it turns out that it may also have been due to a dust storm. That is, the difference was weather, not climate.)

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